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Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

bbc.com

101–110 of 319 posts

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#101
post #78
post #22

Random facts from living 3 months there on why this could be a high potential country: * 10% income tax (second lowest in EU), 5% dividend tax * Very low costs of living (rent is 300-400 eur for a flat in Sofia) * Relatively easy to start companies * It's quite safe, at least safer than Naples from where I am from * Very good quality of food * Close to the seaside (about 3 hours from Greek coast also) * Nice summers…

> * 10% income tax (second lowest in EU), 5% dividend tax But you you have very high social insurance, pension and other welfare fees, just like in any ex-bloc country. They will amount to 30%+ of employment cost.

>But you you have very high social insurance,

iirc, bulgarian social tax was something like 14.5% - retirement, 5% medical. But the best part is: there is max amount for social and it's a joke - less than 1540 euro. Above that it's just not taxed.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#102
post #27

Since a lot of the emigration is to other EU countries it can be comparatively easily reversed. It’s harder for Serbia, Bosnia etc.

It's pretty much irreversible. Most of the emigration comes from Eastern European countries which hardly get any imigrants of their own. Very few people who leave choose to return. Within a generation (two at most) they fully integrate into the foreign culture, so that population is lost.

It depends. If the labour market opens to Ukraine for example, it will have a positive net effect for sure. Why it doesn't open I don't know.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#103
post #74

Bulgarian here, there are a lot of aspects the article does not cover. First one is that up until 1989, Bulgaria was largely an agriculture state with the soviet union being the only market. A heavily controlled market at that. Some might argue that Bulgaria used to produce computers but it was mostly a small assembly line using Intel chips, so no, not really. Mind you the math education was on a good level, hence th…

> First one is that up until 1989, Bulgaria was largely an agriculture state

where did you get this nonsense?

FYI, you've got 6 (SIX!) nuclear reactors build during those times

0 since 1990

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#104
post #80

A side effect of a stagnant economy and population shrinkage is that Bulgarian property is really cheap. You can purchase a modern flat starting around $15,000 (or rent for really cheap) in a ski community with a very strong remote worker presence (Bansko). If you do this right, you can also become a resident and benefit from a flat 10% income tax which is lowest in the EU. No affiliation; I just find this type of ar…

I have a company in Bulgaria while working remotely for a high-salary EU country, and it's almost shocking to realise how much you spend on taxes in most European countries when you see the difference in your bank account. It's quite a good deal if you want to be a digital nomad since it's an EU country and you can get a really small apartment for almost nothing to use as your official address while travelling. (You'…

Is there a way to PM on YM?

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#105

A side effect of a stagnant economy and population shrinkage is that Bulgarian property is really cheap. You can purchase a modern flat starting around $15,000 (or rent for really cheap) in a ski community with a very strong remote worker presence (Bansko). If you do this right, you can also become a resident and benefit from a flat 10% income tax which is lowest in the EU. No affiliation; I just find this type of ar…

That 10% income tax is slightly misleading in that you'll also have to pay social security on your personal income, which is up to 26%. So it's not as if you can pay yourself 100k€ and get 90k€ in your pocket (and while a 10% corporate tax is attractive, it's not out of line with other EU countries like Ireland, Hungary, Estonia, Malta...).

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#107

A side effect of a stagnant economy and population shrinkage is that Bulgarian property is really cheap. You can purchase a modern flat starting around $15,000 (or rent for really cheap) in a ski community with a very strong remote worker presence (Bansko). If you do this right, you can also become a resident and benefit from a flat 10% income tax which is lowest in the EU. No affiliation; I just find this type of ar…

And assuming the EU's freedom of movement holds eventually people and business will realize this and move there. Then they'll do what everyone else does shoot themselves in the foot by making everything expensive. Eventually the new growth will happen elsewhere and the cycle will repeat.

Does that actually work that way? AFAIK the US freedom of movement is mostly resulting in greater and greater concentration... the only non-urban areas that are getting more and more popular are general "nice" (i.e. geographically advantageous) areas, like Florida and ski resorts.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#108
Another Bulgarian here, living in London and contributing to the problem.

This is a good article, but fails to show the breadth of the topic. I also disagree with many of the comments here, which (expectedly) are on the pessimistic side. This pattern of a big spike in migrants when a country joins the EU isn't new. The Polish, the Czech, the Hungarians all experienced this. It might be frightening to project a % of the population leaving yearly far into the future, but it's almost certain that the trend will not continue. There's a trend of economic equalization which starts after a country joins the EU, and this makes it less and less attractive for people to leave over time. So although I don't see net positive migration soon, the current numbers will not be the same long.

Every time a country becomes better off, the most entrepreneurial and driven people reap the benefits first. This is already showing in the big cities in Bulgaria and some of the comments about salaries here agree. Of course it is true that the not-so-skilled haven't benefited yet, but I think this is also going to happen and the current environment will give birth to much innovation and job creation, which will permeate society and give good reasons for even the poor to stay. These processes take time and Bulgaria hasn't yet gone through the full cycle, so we can't judge it yet.

It's true that there's plenty of corruption and bad practices, but if I compare today to what was happening in '97, it's in a different league. We went from rampant hyperinflation and drain of national reserves to small racketeering. If the bar is zero corruption, that will never happen. The good thing about the economic progress from recent years is that it's driven by industries which the mafia can't control. It's no wonder that Software and IT services are such a big employer and contributor, because it's not a business with large tangible assets that can profitably fall into the hands of the wrong people. This means that corruption and mafia have less and less impact on the quality of life of the average citizen. The situation in key strategic industries (e.g. energy) is obviously very different and won't be improving quickly, but that's the case in many developed countries as well.

There are still many things which need to be improved when it comes to quality of service and administration (at least on a public level), but these are solvable problems. I have high hopes and I'm optimistic about what's coming, with an eye open to return one day. And for those who haven't visited yet, I would whole-heartedly recommend it.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#110
post #21
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are the tech salaries like in Bulgaria?

Up to net 4000-5000 from what I have heard. Rent is 300-400 eur in the city center. Dinner is 15 euros, lunch 5-8 euros. A decent apartment is 100-150k.

Wow, that's more than in Slovenia (as far as I know) (another former communist EU country, but officially far more developed) - net salary, I don't know how the tax rates and social contributions compare...
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