Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country • Hacker News Board

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#21

Post by kfk » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:33 PM UTC

moltar wrote: post #14

_hao wrote: post #12

As a Bulgarian living and working in London for more than a year now, I have no intention of going back. The IT sector in the country is booming and the money you can make relative to the cost of living is insane - you can live like a king. To me that is not enough. Money are not enough to make me go back, even though I miss my friends and family. One of the biggest problems for me is that the country is stuck in thi…

What are the tech salaries like in Bulgaria?

Up to net 4000-5000 from what I have heard. Rent is 300-400 eur in the city center. Dinner is 15 euros, lunch 5-8 euros. A decent apartment is 100-150k.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#22

Post by kfk » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:38 PM UTC

Random facts from living 3 months there on why this could be a high potential country:

* 10% income tax (second lowest in EU), 5% dividend tax

* Very low costs of living (rent is 300-400 eur for a flat in Sofia)

* Relatively easy to start companies

* It's quite safe, at least safer than Naples from where I am from

* Very good quality of food

* Close to the seaside (about 3 hours from Greek coast also)

* Nice summers and autumns

* A lot of mountains and land around Sofia, nice nature around

* !Important: probably lots of EU funds for startup. You can probably get funds for your startup w/o investors if you win a EU project

Personally the only issues I have seen are:

* Yeah, lots of people have left, many are in the process of leaving

* "Made in Bulgaria" is not considered a very good brand in EU like "Made in Italy" or "Made in Germany"

Edit. Added EU funds bullet.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#23

Post by NeedMoreTea » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:39 PM UTC

dsego wrote: post #9

misterkolaz wrote: post #6

[flagged]

It's now been almost 30 years. Isn't that enough time to be able to revert the damage and develop prosperity?

The prosperous countries that de-industrialised in the early 80s still have regions that are suffering the after effects. Often still have lack of opportunity, unemployment and poverty far in excess of the national average. Which discourages new businesses locating in the region, which perpetuates...

The former Soviet bloc countries were starting from near bankruptcy, and extreme neglect over a far longer period. They may have developed pockets of wealth, maybe much more development in the capital. The picture across the whole country will be much more mixed.

Without focused development spending and redistribution, training, encouraging business etc, it takes generations to play out.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#24

Post by lucian1900 » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:40 PM UTC

misterkolaz wrote: post #6

[flagged]

Yet the material conditions of the people are worse now than 30 years ago. The same in Romania.

Our countries were destroyed by capitalism being forced on them, after a long siege by US empire.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#25

Post by cpursley » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:42 PM UTC

A side effect of a stagnant economy and population shrinkage is that Bulgarian property is really cheap. You can purchase a modern flat starting around $15,000 (or rent for really cheap) in a ski community with a very strong remote worker presence (Bansko).

If you do this right, you can also become a resident and benefit from a flat 10% income tax which is lowest in the EU. No affiliation; I just find this type of arbitrage fascinating (and am currently doing something similar on the Black Sea coast of a different non-eu country).

- https://www.travelingwithkristin.com/digital-nomad-blog/2019...

- https://medium.com/@matthiasezeitler/where-nomads-can-buy-an...

- https://medium.com/@coworkingbansko/how-any-non-eu-citizen-b...

- https://medium.com/@coworkingbansko/getting-bulgarian-tax-re...

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#26

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:45 PM UTC

cpursley wrote: post #25

A side effect of a stagnant economy and population shrinkage is that Bulgarian property is really cheap. You can purchase a modern flat starting around $15,000 (or rent for really cheap) in a ski community with a very strong remote worker presence (Bansko). If you do this right, you can also become a resident and benefit from a flat 10% income tax which is lowest in the EU. No affiliation; I just find this type of ar…

[deleted]

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#27

Post by mihaifm » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:46 PM UTC

the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #5

Since a lot of the emigration is to other EU countries it can be comparatively easily reversed. It’s harder for Serbia, Bosnia etc.

It's pretty much irreversible. Most of the emigration comes from Eastern European countries which hardly get any imigrants of their own. Very few people who leave choose to return. Within a generation (two at most) they fully integrate into the foreign culture, so that population is lost.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#28

Post by StavrosK » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:47 PM UTC

kfk wrote: post #22

Random facts from living 3 months there on why this could be a high potential country: * 10% income tax (second lowest in EU), 5% dividend tax * Very low costs of living (rent is 300-400 eur for a flat in Sofia) * Relatively easy to start companies * It's quite safe, at least safer than Naples from where I am from * Very good quality of food * Close to the seaside (about 3 hours from Greek coast also) * Nice summers…

I hope the new Greek government manages to compete with this, so the next post will advertise Greece in this way. Most of your list applies here as well, except we have amazing food and beaches.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#29

Post by mschuster91 » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:49 PM UTC

mieseratte wrote: post #13

dsego wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's now been almost 30 years. Isn't that enough time to be able to revert the damage and develop prosperity?

Even in prosperous Germany, the formerly communist East is well behind the capitalist West. One would assume for a nation with less means the problems would be more pronounced.

> Even in prosperous Germany, the formerly communist East is well behind the capitalist West.

That's "thanks" to the Treuhand scandal. West Germany essentially bled East Germany dry - brains, infrastructure, everything.

East Germany perfectly shows what happens when all young people who can flee - the only ones remaining will be conservatives and outright Nazis.

Re: Bulgaria is the world’s fastest-shrinking country

#30

Post by mdw » Wed, Oct 02, 2019, 12:50 PM UTC

I’ve been living in Bulgaria for the past 4 months, bootstrapping my startup. I can say Bulgaria is a great place to come due to its affordable cost of living, comparable to Thailand/Bali, but easy access to European cities, for me it was the best choice. The community of digital workers in Bansko, Bulgaria is really growing.