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Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

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Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#511

Post by JPKab »

shadowgovt wrote: post #501
tomschlick wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but the justification is that these classes are/have been historically discriminated against and constitutional admissions which take race into consideration are a temporary measure to right these historical wrongs by leveling the playing field. So under that thought process... when does the temporary measure end? Is there a specific goal? Or is it something unachievable like "when income inequality is fixed".

Who says fixing income inequality is unachievable?

Are all of your coworkers equally productive? Neighbors? Relatives?

The answer for all 3 for me personally is no. I have family members who make decisions based on different priorities which change their income. My coworkers differ radically in their abilities and work ethic. How can they have equal incomes in this scenario? There is a way to do this, and it hasn't worked any time it's been tried.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#512

Post by richmunk567 »

simmanian wrote: post #492
dwoozle wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Harvard and UC are trying to do different things. Harvard is trying to admit the future leaders of the world, so it can point to them and say “They are Harvard men.” UC is trying to give an academically rigorous education to the most academically qualified students.

Are you arguing that Asians inherently make worse leaders than people of other races? To me, Harvard keeping Asians out would create a negative feedback loop where Asians are not perceived as leader materials.

https://www.unz.com/article/why-harvard-is-right-to-discrimi...

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#513

Post by thrill »

gnicholas wrote: post #352
thrill wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kagan, an Obama nominee, skipped the Texas case. I think it'd be ruled the same way this time.

I would guess it would be 5-4 against Harvard, with Thomas, Alito, Kavanaugh, Gorsuch, and Roberts in the majority. Which one of these would you have ruling in favor of Harvard's AA plan?

I believe Roberts would vote with Harvard.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#514

Post by richmunk567 »

rohit2412 wrote: post #298
dwoozle wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Harvard and UC are trying to do different things. Harvard is trying to admit the future leaders of the world, so it can point to them and say “They are Harvard men.” UC is trying to give an academically rigorous education to the most academically qualified students.

So, asians are less likely to be leaders because of their race? African-Americans are more likely to be leaders because of their race?

At the same level juvenile accomplishment, yes almost certainly:

https://www.unz.com/article/why-harvard-is-right-to-discrimi...

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#515

Post by simmanian »

richmunk567 wrote: post #514
rohit2412 wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, asians are less likely to be leaders because of their race? African-Americans are more likely to be leaders because of their race?

At the same level juvenile accomplishment, yes almost certainly: https://www.unz.com/article/why-harvard-is-right-to-discrimi...

Isn't it against the site policy to post blatant white supremacist content?

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#516

Post by richmunk567 »

JPKab wrote: post #504
bigendian1234 wrote: post #459

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, I'm a white person who used to think of affirmative action as unfair discrimination. That was true until I spent time volunteering teaching technical skills to kids in poor immigrant neighborhoods. Now that I have had an up close experience with these communities, I'm here to tell you institutional racism is real and we're far from it making sense to end these programs. There simply is not a quick easy solution…

Do you think the kids in poor immigrant neighborhoods are in worse positions than poor kids in eastern Kentucky? Because the current policies treat white kids from trailer parks like white kids from fancy suburbs. And they treat FOB Asians like they are doctor's children. And black kids from fancy suburbs are treated as if they came from poor ghettos. The idea that "oppression" is limited to dimensions of race and ge…

>they treat FOB Asians like they are doctor's children

Diversity measures not withstanding, universities try to admit the students most likely to go on to have the most success in adult life and for Asians adolescent academic performance is a worse predictor of this than for Europeans.

https://www.unz.com/article/why-harvard-is-right-to-discrimi...

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#517

Post by koolba »

wavefunction wrote: post #497
packet881 wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Feel free to make your voice heard by your vote and donate from your paycheck. This is a zero sum game and my ancestors were not oppressing either latinos or Africans. I'll make my voice heard by not voting for Democrats.

This Judge was confirmed by the Senate which has been in Republican hands for some time. You should go start your own Harvard and you can exclude or admit anyone you want.

> This Judge was confirmed by the Senate which has been in Republican hands for some time.

The judge was appointed by President Obama and confirmed by a Democrat controlled Senate: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allison_Dale_Burroughs

Federal judgeships are lifetime appointments so the current makeup of the Senate, short of impeaching her, has no relevance.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#518

Post by maehwasu »

mikelyons wrote: post #505
maehwasu wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s very enforceable. It’s just that it really, really sucks to live in a society that implements that enforcement.

I don't believe you, can you give some examples?

Khmer Rouge killing lots of intellectuals is one classic example, although most socialist revolutions had their own variants.

I suppose you can do a No True Scotsman and say that those weren’t truly enforcing equality of outcome since there were people at the top of that society doing the enforcing, but most would find that argument pretty strained.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#519

Post by richmunk567 »

simmanian wrote: post #515
richmunk567 wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At the same level juvenile accomplishment, yes almost certainly: https://www.unz.com/article/why-harvard-is-right-to-discrimi...

Isn't it against the site policy to post blatant white supremacist content?

Unz is Jewish.

Re: Federal Judge Upholds Harvard's Race-Conscious Admissions Process

#520

Post by creaghpatr »

yostrovs wrote: post #407
ineedasername wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But Harvard is a private school, which I think makes a difference. I also don't know how you maintain a diverse student body with different cultural perspectives if you aren't in some way filtering on cultural background, of which race is a part. Honestly, I don't know . I don't think it's an easy question. However, I think there's a decent case that, if Harvard is making decisions like this, it's ability to receive…

Since Harvard receives federal funds, it has to play by the same anti discrimination rules as the Federal government.

Not to mention incredible tax treatment of their assets.
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