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Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

abc.net.au

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Re: Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

#31

Post by mieseratte »

journalctl wrote: post #29
golergka wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you really lack perspective on what any warfare is: it's always critical, life or death decisions that have to be taken without sufficient information. US civilian to combatant casualty ratio in the recent conflicts have been significantly better than any other modern wars as well. So, what do you suggest instead?

Have we considered maybe _not_ killing them?

Welcome to war. Bad intel kills good people.

I would be more concerned with the classification of any male over 16 killed in a strike as an automatic combatant than a single given operation gone wrong. This is an unavoidable aspect of war.

Re: Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

#32

Post by mieseratte »

elif wrote: post #16
golergka wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you really lack perspective on what any warfare is: it's always critical, life or death decisions that have to be taken without sufficient information. US civilian to combatant casualty ratio in the recent conflicts have been significantly better than any other modern wars as well. So, what do you suggest instead?

>life or death decisions that have to be taken without sufficient information. Sounds like you're describing warfare before Geneva conventions or the somehow permitted US war crimes to me.

When did the Taliban sign on to Geneva?

Re: Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

#33

Post by mieseratte »

rhizome wrote: post #20
tomohawk wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US did overreact and attempted to do nation building in Afghanistan. But your prescription for letting them sort things out on their own has already been tried, and it was a colossal failure. The government hosted terrorist organizations who killed thousands of people in the US and mounted attacks on civilians of many nationalities around the world.

Afghanistan has been a known quantity for decades: heroin or Taliban, pick one. Beyond that, what's the international opinion on Erik Prince?

Taliban hosted AQ, gave us 9/11. We may be stuck in a quagmire, but there’s more to the Taliban than banning heroin and to pretend otherwise is disingenuous.

Re: Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

#35

Post by [deleted] »

mieseratte wrote: post #32
elif wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>life or death decisions that have to be taken without sufficient information. Sounds like you're describing warfare before Geneva conventions or the somehow permitted US war crimes to me.

When did the Taliban sign on to Geneva?

[deleted]

Re: Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

#36

Post by glloydell »

anigbrowl wrote: post #2

The other day a drone in Afghanistan killed 30 civilians. Rather than being ISIS members holding a meeting, they were pine nut farmers gathering around a fire to relax after their day's work. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-afghanistan-attack-drones... I don't really give a fuck about the psychological condition of the drone pilots except insofar as it puts their children at risk. They and their commanders should…

Your comment strikes me as textbook dehumanization of the drone pilots.

"Dehumanizing the enemy involves denying the enemy’s humanity by negating in the enemy the characteristics normally associated with human beings, such as morality and compassion, and instead associating the enemy with acts of evil and depravity that merit forceful action and retaliation."

https://sk.sagepub.com/reference/the-sage-encyclopedia-of-wa...

The irony here is pretty intense.

Re: Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

#37

Post by harimau777 »

devoply wrote: post #19
harimau777 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure that's a fair characterization. Regardless of whether the US should have gotten involved or should have seen future problems coming, my understanding is that at the time that the US was supporting the Mujahideen they were attacking military targets and where therefore guerrilla fighters, not terrorists.

It's funny how brainwashed most Americans are about this conflict, we might as well as be living in 1984's world. Have you heard the ancient saying one man's freedom fighter, another man's terrorist? What would happen if no terrorists had been trained by the US (and their Islamic puppet that wags the dog, Saudi Arabia)? The Soviet Union would have fallen and Afghanistan would be a normal country like its neighbors. >…

Nothing in your post contradicts what I said. I'm arguing that the difference between a freedom fighter and a terrorist is whether they target civilians. So when fighting the Soviets or later the US, the Taliban where not terrorists; although that doesn't necessarily mean that they were good people.

Re: Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

#38

Post by golemiprague »

anigbrowl wrote: post #2

The other day a drone in Afghanistan killed 30 civilians. Rather than being ISIS members holding a meeting, they were pine nut farmers gathering around a fire to relax after their day's work. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-afghanistan-attack-drones... I don't really give a fuck about the psychological condition of the drone pilots except insofar as it puts their children at risk. They and their commanders should…

What it got to do with drones? assuming the report is correct which I doubt, a lot of civilians got killed in wars even before drones got into the arena. If anything, overall drones helps a lot with verifying viable targets compared to times when commanders didn't have those eyes in the sky.

Re: Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

#39

Post by elif »

mieseratte wrote: post #32
elif wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>life or death decisions that have to be taken without sufficient information. Sounds like you're describing warfare before Geneva conventions or the somehow permitted US war crimes to me.

When did the Taliban sign on to Geneva?

Not only does your logic bending (to for some reason avoid the basis of wartime morality?) fail in its own premise as the Taliban is not allowed to meet your standard as they are not a sovereign nation able to be a signatory, the convention itself does not work as you imply:

"this Protocol must be fully applied in all circumstances to all persons who are protected by those instruments, without any adverse distinction based on the nature or origin of the armed conflict"

Re: Drone pilots could be experiencing 'sniper's syndrome'

#40

Post by harimau777 »

elif wrote: post #16
golergka wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you really lack perspective on what any warfare is: it's always critical, life or death decisions that have to be taken without sufficient information. US civilian to combatant casualty ratio in the recent conflicts have been significantly better than any other modern wars as well. So, what do you suggest instead?

>life or death decisions that have to be taken without sufficient information. Sounds like you're describing warfare before Geneva conventions or the somehow permitted US war crimes to me.

I'm not sure that I understand your argument. War consisted of making life or death decisions based on insufficient information both before and after the Geneva conventions.
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