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Berlin Key

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Re: Berlin Key

#71

Post by samtho »

v64 wrote: post #33
ChristianBundy wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can't leave through my (brand new, to-code) front door from inside without a key to unlock it first. I'm sure I'm just ignorant, but it sounds like your lock is on backward. Every front door I've ever seen can be unlocked from the inside without a key. Example: https://www.lowes.com/pd/Schlage-Deadbolt-Satin-Brass-Single... Could you link to a lock that's similar to what you're talking about? I'd feel very unco…

Here's an example of my deadbolt that's keyed on both sides: https://i.imgur.com/xXzWS7j.png

Those are peodominately used in situations where someone could reach in (via a broken window or space between bars) and simply unlock it. A solid door should not have this type of lock in the US.

Re: Berlin Key

#72

Post by noja »

happy-go-lucky wrote: post #69
Someone wrote: post #17

The English description on that page doesn’t make it easy to understand what this key does. ”Its name comes from the fact that it has two key blades (the part which activates the bolt) at each end of the key, rather than the usual single blade” How does that lead to the name “Berlin key” or either of the German names? I would guess “Berlin key” comes from the fact that it predominantly is used in Berlin. ”After unloc…

So here a video is worth a million words :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wE_6e3GPe4 Edit: I read the first paragraph twice and then to confirm my understanding I turned to YouTube.

They showed the key on video facepalm

Re: Berlin Key

#73

Post by tmb »

atoav wrote: post #36
esrauch wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an American living in Switzerland one thing that has consistently surprised me is the difference in fire safety rules: not having any smoke alarm or fire extinguishers in homes is common, and it's also common to be able to lock people inside rooms/apartments/buildings so that they can't leave without having a key. It's possible to lock someone in my apartment even if they have the key if the door is locked with th…

I grew up in Austria and live in Germany (so two neighbouring countries to Switzerland) and here it is mandatory to have at least smoke alarms. Fire extinguishers are mostly only needed for public buildings and server rooms and such. Germans especially take their "Brandschutz" very seriously especially regarding emergency exits etc. However in the end you are responsible for your own safety. If you are in a room with…

You should also take care not to light your house or person on fire, which is a bad idea and probably also illegal (regardless of will).

Re: Berlin Key

#74

Post by usrusr »

lillesvin wrote: post #56
School-Cotton wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, TIL. Never realized this was a US-specific thing.

It's definitely not US specific. Here in Denmark it's standard that the front door opens from the inside without a key. Same goes for at least Luxembourg and Germany as far as I know.

Germany checking in: all the front doors I know are two stage: first stage closes just by falling into the lock and and opens keyless from the inside, second stage requires key action for both closing and opening, on both sides.

Re: Berlin Key

#75

Post by noodlesUK »

_jal wrote: post #22
decebalus1 wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't know about Switzerland, but as an European living in the US, I think the American fire safety rules are what they are mainly because most houses here are basically matchstick houses built from prefab low quality wood which would get devoured by flames in minutes. And the fire-resistant building materials are super toxic when they actually burn. So fire is a very big deal... Anecdotal, we had a fire in my buildi…

I stayed in a house in Germany in which the walls were filled with dried-straw for insulation. It was several hundred years old. There was a no-smoking rule.

I have a similar anecdote. The walls of the main building at my university were full of hay and paraffin wax. This is in the UK. We were very conscious of fire safety there...

Re: Berlin Key

#76

Post by asveikau »

School-Cotton wrote: post #46
wazoox wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never seen that outside the US. Keyholes both sides of the door, everywhere. When it's closed, you need a key or you don't get out.

Well, TIL. Never realized this was a US-specific thing.

I don't think it's US-specific, as I have seen it work the "US" way abundantly when traveling.

But having it not work this way is very unusual in the states, while common to not exactly rare in some other places.

Re: Berlin Key

#77

Post by chrisseaton »

School-Cotton wrote: post #68
mattlondon wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The vast majority of locks have a physical unlocking mechanism on one side Not where I live. Sure the lock that you use to stop it blowing open in the wind (1) when you are at home has a latch on the inside (making it easy to open door to visitors etc), but you also have the real lock that you use when you leave the house require keys from either side (2). I think most home insurance in the UK would either not insu…

As long as you don’t have easily breakable glass within reaching distance of the unlocking mechanism, why is a lock that can be unlocked from inside less secure?

Because breaking through one small panel on a door and then reaching through and turning the lock is a lot easier than having to break away the entire door so you can get your body through.

Re: Berlin Key

#78

Post by mattlondon »

School-Cotton wrote: post #68
mattlondon wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The vast majority of locks have a physical unlocking mechanism on one side Not where I live. Sure the lock that you use to stop it blowing open in the wind (1) when you are at home has a latch on the inside (making it easy to open door to visitors etc), but you also have the real lock that you use when you leave the house require keys from either side (2). I think most home insurance in the UK would either not insu…

As long as you don’t have easily breakable glass within reaching distance of the unlocking mechanism, why is a lock that can be unlocked from inside less secure?

I think the problem is not that it can be opened from the inside but more that the ones that just have a lever to flick on the inside are usually yale style locks that are easy to bump or pick, or break a window and reach, or put something through the letter box to reach.

The mortice locks are harder to pick and are usually substantially sturdier in construction. In the UK at least, the mortice lock is physically inside the door structure (1) whereas the latches that don't need keys are attached on the door (2).

We recently had a break-in in the block of apartments where I live where the latch attached on the door was broken off by people forcing a door. If there had been a mortice lock, they'd have to break the door frame or the door itself, rather than just bust the weak latch lock off the back of the door (in this case the door opened outwards, so they just pulled on the door handle whilst bracing a leg against thethe wall and the latch came right off the back of the door)

1 - https://www.buildingsheriff.com/mortice-lock-costs_files/sta... 2 - https://www.diydoctor.org.uk/images/nightlatch.jpg

Re: Berlin Key

#79

Post by tdj »

atoav wrote: post #29
Someone wrote: post #17

The English description on that page doesn’t make it easy to understand what this key does. ”Its name comes from the fact that it has two key blades (the part which activates the bolt) at each end of the key, rather than the usual single blade” How does that lead to the name “Berlin key” or either of the German names? I would guess “Berlin key” comes from the fact that it predominantly is used in Berlin. ”After unloc…

The Berlin key ("Berliner Schlüssel") was mostly used in tenements with multiple backyard houses with a common front gate that should be closed at certain times. These kind of arrangements were mostly used in Berlin, hence the name. The other German names for the key describe different aspects of it: "Durchsteckschlüssel" translates to "push-through-key" and "Doppelschlüssel" translates to "double-key". If you are mo…

The building I live in in Berlin, 1910-ish construction with two more wings in the courtyard, everything accessible through the front gate - it has the same principle implemented with a timer and a button. I thought it's a bit odd, but made some sense after a while.

During the day, the front gate can be opened from the outside with just pushing a button that unlocks the door. At night (from 20 or 21 or so), the button stops working, you need the key. It can be opened at any time from the inside without keys. So it's more or less implementing the same protocol, but electro-mechanically, so there is no need for the trick with pulling the key inward.

Re: Berlin Key

#80

Post by modriano »

username90 wrote: post #21
esrauch wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an American living in Switzerland one thing that has consistently surprised me is the difference in fire safety rules: not having any smoke alarm or fire extinguishers in homes is common, and it's also common to be able to lock people inside rooms/apartments/buildings so that they can't leave without having a key. It's possible to lock someone in my apartment even if they have the key if the door is locked with th…

You are much more likely to die in a fire in USA, so it makes sense for Americans to take more measurements to prevent it. But in for example Switzerland fires is not a big thing so there is no need to have any laws against it. https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/fire-death-rates

Based on this data, the fire death rate in the US is 1.16 per 100k pop. and the rate in Switzerland is 0.28 per 100k pop. Percentage wise, that's a big difference, but that's only because both of these numbers are extremely small. I don't think it's really accurate to say you're much more likely to die in a fire in the USA; it's extremely rare in both countries.
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