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Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

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Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#231

Post by thekyle »

brenden2 wrote: post #77
londons_explore wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Whatsapp binary is sufficiently transparent to enable someone determined to write their own client. Thats enough info for an expert to verify their "messages are end to end encrypted and we don't know the key" claim. The fly in the ointment is the client might have additional functionality to leak the e2e encryption key. That is far harder to find, but if it's use were widespread, it would be found by researchers…

Yep, the chat log backup basically renders WhatsApp completely insecure. They also constantly nag you inside the app to enable it. This is how they caught Michael Cohen (and presumably others). Unfortunately Signal does it, too.

I don't think that Signal uploads the backups to the cloud though. It seems like they're stored on device and encrypted.

Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#232

Post by autokad »

GordonS wrote: post #220

The idea that moves like this will "keep us safe" is utterly preposterous; there are a multitude of other ways in which terrorists (or the boogeyman de jour ) could communicate - are the UK and US governments going to insist on backdooring IRC, Slack and face-to-face conversations? Are they going to outlaw encryption libraries? I truely fear for the future that western governments, in particular the 5 eyes members, a…

From what I can tell, it seems like the US is not forcing a backdoor. is that correct? This sounds like UK is forcing the issue.

However, I don't care if it "keeps us safe". It's just wrong in so many ways

Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#233

Post by edoceo »

UncleMeat wrote: post #209
brenden2 wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to use Gentoo, and I built my entire OS from source. I'm not extraordinary in any way, I'm just an ordinary person who has a deep interest in software and computers.

I'd wager that fewer than 1/100,000 humans on the planet could feasibly build Gentoo from source.

I've done two "stage one" builds of Gentoo. I'm not super skilled but, I had a lot of time and reference material. My bet is that folks could but would not want to. There is significant time cost.

Also, I'm still using one of those original builds on my laptop - upgraded of course...still mad love for my daily driver.

Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#234

Post by jhh »

GordonS wrote: post #220

The idea that moves like this will "keep us safe" is utterly preposterous; there are a multitude of other ways in which terrorists (or the boogeyman de jour ) could communicate - are the UK and US governments going to insist on backdooring IRC, Slack and face-to-face conversations? Are they going to outlaw encryption libraries? I truely fear for the future that western governments, in particular the 5 eyes members, a…

Still remember how one German Islamist terror group just used their web-email provider's draft feature. They never 'sent' anything. There are often quite simple ways to circumvent this kind of thing.

Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#235

Post by chooseaname »

> Social media platforms based in the U.S. including Facebook and WhatsApp will be forced to share users’ encrypted messages with British police under a new treaty between the two countries, according to a person familiar with the matter.

Would Apple's iMessage qualify? (I can't read the whole article because of the paywall).

Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#236

Post by pg_is_a_butt »

GordonS wrote: post #220

The idea that moves like this will "keep us safe" is utterly preposterous; there are a multitude of other ways in which terrorists (or the boogeyman de jour ) could communicate - are the UK and US governments going to insist on backdooring IRC, Slack and face-to-face conversations? Are they going to outlaw encryption libraries? I truely fear for the future that western governments, in particular the 5 eyes members, a…

The only reason we are allowed guns is to use them to overthrow such corrupt governments before they overrun the planet starting with cooking the jews.

So... use them, pussies.

Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#237

Post by Spearchucker »

autokad wrote: post #232
GordonS wrote: post #220

The idea that moves like this will "keep us safe" is utterly preposterous; there are a multitude of other ways in which terrorists (or the boogeyman de jour ) could communicate - are the UK and US governments going to insist on backdooring IRC, Slack and face-to-face conversations? Are they going to outlaw encryption libraries? I truely fear for the future that western governments, in particular the 5 eyes members, a…

From what I can tell, it seems like the US is not forcing a backdoor. is that correct? This sounds like UK is forcing the issue. However, I don't care if it "keeps us safe". It's just wrong in so many ways

No matter. Under 5 eyes if one has it they all have it.

Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#238

Post by jedberg »

hnthrow0693 wrote: post #227
jedberg wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Unless your mom is planning to involve herself in illegal activities I don't see a problem. I assume you'd be happy to post all your credit card receipts and emails for all of us to see then. You're not doing anything illegal, right? That would be the only reason you don't want those things to be visible.

What exactly leads you to believe that posting your credit card number on hacker news is somehow equivalent to not being outraged by the U.S. sharing _encrypted_ messages of suspected terrorists with the UK? Let’s not pretend the world is so black and white.

I was arguing against the idea of "if you're not doing anything wrong you have nothing to hide".

It's a bad attitude to have because allowing the government to have that power at all is a problem, even for terrorists and murderers and pedophiles. Because we don't know if people are those things until we investigate them, which means the government gets broad powers to investigate people to look for those kinds of crimes, and maybe find other people they want to get for other reasons.

I used to investigate computer crime. Yeah, my job would have been a lot easier if I had unlimited access to anyone's email. But instead I had to investigate and build a case without privileged access. It was harder, but I was glad that the system couldn't be abused.

Why should governments or law enforcement have privileged access?

Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#239

Post by claudiawerner »

paulddraper wrote: post #175
pmlnr wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You can't pay rent with good feelings. So just keep making the world shittier. Gotta love individualist capitalism.

To paraphrase Adam Smith, nothing has helped more people more than self-interest in a free market. Raised the standard of living for billions.

Fortunately for normative social theory and political economy, a lot of research has happened since Adam Smith evengalized self-interest and the free market.

Re: Facebook, WhatsApp Will Have to Share Messages With U.K.?

#240

Post by Simon_says »

GordonS wrote: post #220

The idea that moves like this will "keep us safe" is utterly preposterous; there are a multitude of other ways in which terrorists (or the boogeyman de jour ) could communicate - are the UK and US governments going to insist on backdooring IRC, Slack and face-to-face conversations? Are they going to outlaw encryption libraries? I truely fear for the future that western governments, in particular the 5 eyes members, a…

> Are they going to outlaw encryption libraries?

Yes. Absolutely. That's the only logical endgame.

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