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Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

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Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#121

Post by whenchamenia »

scarmig wrote: post #57
AlexB138 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> surely you'd agree that someone trolling kids online ... should be ashamed of themselves and driven out of polite society, yes? I think pretty much everyone involved here, aside from the children, ought to be ashamed of themselves. I don't buy into the idea that people ought to be driven out of society though.

So parents are just as bad for letting children engage in activism as the people threatening to murder and rape them?

Its like taking your kid to a strip club. Its putting your child in danger to begin with. Of course trolls are still responsible for their behavior, but the parents are not off the hook.

Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#122

Post by NeedMoreTea »

So many claiming it's adults pulling strings and getting their kids into politics or activism.

Just one point to make to that: For any kid protesting, or caring about climate, it's been an issue that's been constantly in the background their whole damn life. Longer than they've been able to read.

Things we've had longer than 18 years: Recycling bins; climate and associated environmental stories such as species loss on news, documentaries, in schools; politicians talking about, dismissing and greenwashing climate; climate related taxes; alternative lightbulbs, insulation and low-energy promotions from utility companies. [other countries may vary on details, and age of majority]

How can they possibly not be forming strong opinions, and wanting to do something?

Remember CND and the peace movements? That was part of the kid's and youth culture of the sixties - for that generation that was impossible to miss with the constant Cold War backdrop. This generation gets added trolling and conspiracy claims of it being adults pulling strings.

Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#123

Post by CompanionCuuube »

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #96
Porthos9K wrote: post #94

Why are children under 13 even being allowed to create social media accounts?

Facebook and Twitter never, ever restricted them from doing so. You don't need age verification or ID to sign up.

Then they should have a reporting option that goes something like "User is under 13" which requires a verification of parental consent to continue use of the account, otherwise it's just a blatant violation of COPPA.

Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#124

Post by repolfx »

Retric wrote: post #60
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #11

>mom of 8-year-old climate activist Havana Chapman-Edwards Is it just me, or is there something disturbing about an 8 year old activist for anything? I cannot see anything good coming from turning young children into activists. Kids that age need love and stability, not the fear that the world is going to end unless they do something.

It’s a question of agency. Young children rarely get the feeling that anything they do has inherent value. Something as simple as gathering twigs for a campfire is unusual specifically because it’s helpful. Activism at that age is a mix of learning experience and actually useful. So, IMO it can be a positive activity in the right context.

But there's nothing an 8 year old can do to be helpful for climate change. At 8 you don't even really understand what the climate is or how it's different from weather, let alone what CO2 or methane are.

This appears to just be a continuation of the disturbing trend of adults trying to make themselves feel virtuous by speaking through their children.

Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#125

Post by repolfx »

jakobegger wrote: post #68
AlexB138 wrote: post #14

Using children as political tools is disgusting. It's blatantly manipulative. Throwing them into the cess-pool of public politics and then acting as if you're shocked they're in a cess-pool, and using that shock to try to score political points, is one of the more reprehensible tactics in the modern play book.

Yeah, kids have no place in politics. They should stay quiet, play minecraft, impress their parents with fun science projects, but under no circumstances should they speak out, and anybody amplifying their voice is disgusting and reprehensible.

It's amazing to me this is actually a debate. The US Constitution forbids people under 25 from being in Congress because children are not expected to have reasonable political opinions. They're children! They've never paid tax, worked or truly made their own decisions or experienced the consequences.

In this case, do you think these children are being presented with any alternate views at all? Are any of them being presented with the arguments of climate change skeptics in a neutral forum? Of course not. Most adults are never presented with these arguments, let alone children. No, they're being told that for inexplicable reasons the world is filled with evil people who want everyone to die and they ... children ... must fight them or the world will end! That'd have been like telling 8 year olds in the 1950s they had to fight communism. There's no way bringing children of that age into things can ever be a good idea.

Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#126

Post by repolfx »

Porthos9K wrote: post #93
dyeje wrote: post #21

Has anyone tried to do an analysis on these trolls? Who are they and why are they trolling? I'm concerned that these aren't normal people and instead people interested in maintaining the status quo are coordinating these activities.

My default assumption is that trolls attacking any sort of "leftist" activist are either alt-reich channers or corporate astroturfers. I don't assume good faith on the part of trolls, but instead always suspect an ulterior motive.

Do you believe it's ever possible for anyone to genuinely disagree with leftist activism in good faith? It sounds a lot like the answer is no.

Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#127

Post by buboard »

ASalazarMX wrote: post #120
buboard wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No just dont amplify them so incredibly much. They are children in the end, they deserve protection Trolling is a fundamental right , not being trolled is not

Trolling is not a right, it's an abuse of a right. You have freedom to express yourself, but using that freedom to harass others for fun is strongly discouraged in society. It flies on the Internet because people can show their worst behavior with practically no discouragement.

Trolling is not harassment. It 's a protected right, just like most expression.

Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#128

Post by buboard »

iron0013 wrote: post #98
buboard wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this rhetoric is going a bit too far. The UN children's convention protects children . When (and if) climate change will affect these people they will be adults.

What rhetoric? And of course, by the time they are adults it will be far too late to act.

the rhetoric that "inaction is violating children's rights". It's a slippery slope: What about financial debt?

Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#129

Post by Porthos9K »

repolfx wrote: post #126
Porthos9K wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My default assumption is that trolls attacking any sort of "leftist" activist are either alt-reich channers or corporate astroturfers. I don't assume good faith on the part of trolls, but instead always suspect an ulterior motive.

Do you believe it's ever possible for anyone to genuinely disagree with leftist activism in good faith? It sounds a lot like the answer is no.

It depends. The answer is "yes" when dealing with people with whom I have regular face-to-face conversations.

When it comes to randos on the internet who hide behind anime or Warhammer 40K avatars and post mostly memes, the answer is "hell, no".

Re: Trolls Are Swarming Young Climate Activists Online

#130

Post by freeplay »

repolfx wrote: post #125
jakobegger wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, kids have no place in politics. They should stay quiet, play minecraft, impress their parents with fun science projects, but under no circumstances should they speak out, and anybody amplifying their voice is disgusting and reprehensible.

It's amazing to me this is actually a debate. The US Constitution forbids people under 25 from being in Congress because children are not expected to have reasonable political opinions. They're children! They've never paid tax, worked or truly made their own decisions or experienced the consequences. In this case, do you think these children are being presented with any alternate views at all? Are any of them being p…

Have you considered the possibility that these kids are actually just passionate about it? And what are these "alternate views" regarding climate change you mention? There is the truth and there is misinformation perpetuated by the oil/natural gas/plastic/etc companies and those getting paid by them.

Think about it. When you're a kid, you're not yet jaded by the harsh realities of the world. That corporations drive everything and we are basically just along for the ride.

The kids are looking at our dying planet and wondering "why is nobody doing anything?!?" I often feel the same way. The difference is, I have to go to work and focus on providing for my family. I also know that no amount of protesting or public speaking will change the path we are on in any significant way. Children still believe they can make a difference and I admire that passion. They are not worried about how old they are because they are watching the "adults" sit around and argue over even the smallest of corrective measures (carbon tax).

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