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America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

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Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#371

Post by krapp »

strenholme wrote: post #366
krapp wrote: post #365

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a strawman. Marriage has no effect whatsoever on consent. >It’s much less likely a sexual assault accusation will happen in a marriage. Do you have data to back this up?

Two out of three sexual assault allegations involve incidents when the person was not in an established intimate relationship with the person: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/sexual-assault-victims/ Again, when did I ever say that “marital rape is OK”? I did not, and it’s a strawman to claim that I did.

I didn't think you were claiming marital rape was OK, I thought you were claiming it didn't exist, which is an unfortunately common belief. I misinterpreted your intent and I apologize.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#372

Post by complexvisitor »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #335
asveikau wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hope you don't taken offence, but since you mentioned groceries I am curious what you think of something like a food bank? About a month ago I started volunteering passing out groceries at one of those here in San Francisco. I don't know what the process is like for recipients, but I see the same faces come in each week, regular looking people, sometimes with family or children in tow, and they seem pretty well provi…

I've done that in the past. I have a serious medical condition with significant dietary restrictions, a dead fridge and limited cooking ability. When I did that recently, a lot of what I got was cold food which spoiled overnight because my fridge is dead and I don't have the funds to replace it right now. It's just vastly better for me if I earn the money and it's not a huge amount that I need, so it's frustrating as…

If you search Craigslist, you can find working refrigerators for free. Here is a link

https://sfbay.craigslist.org/search/sss?query=Free%20refrige...

For what it's worth, I think you're a great person. I hope you find food and income security soon!

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#373

Post by paggle »

wnoise wrote: post #81
paggle wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes an organization needs to act with less power to punish, but also less standard of proof. For example, NFL player Ray Rice was caught on video punching his girlfriend unconscious. The NFL can’t put him in prison, but they did suspend him from the league, because he was a toxic brand even though his girlfriend did not press criminal or civil charges. These universities are government organizations, but also l…

Many of them are not government organizations. Even the ones that are, are state organizations, not federal. They do all take federal money though...

The Supreme Court has held that most Constitutional protections from the federal government also apply to state governments.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#374

Post by DoreenMichele »

complexvisitor wrote: post #372
DoreenMichele wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've done that in the past. I have a serious medical condition with significant dietary restrictions, a dead fridge and limited cooking ability. When I did that recently, a lot of what I got was cold food which spoiled overnight because my fridge is dead and I don't have the funds to replace it right now. It's just vastly better for me if I earn the money and it's not a huge amount that I need, so it's frustrating as…

If you search Craigslist, you can find working refrigerators for free. Here is a link https://sfbay.craigslist.org/search/sss?query=Free%20refrige... For what it's worth, I think you're a great person. I hope you find food and income security soon!

Thanks.

Due to the medical issues in the family, cleanliness is a really high priority. The manager of the building has been amazingly supportive. He offered to give us a fridge from a different room, but it was a horror show of filth and I asked him to remove it the same day, which he very graciously did.

He also tried to repair the fridge that died, but it couldn't be repaired.

I honestly just need to come up with the money and buy a small new fridge for probably under $200.

My income is gradually going up. It's just painfully slow and frustrating as all hell, which has me living from crisis to crisis and I hate it.

Sexism isn't the only factor. I brought up my point of view in hopes of supporting a larger point, which may have been a mistake.

Anyway, trying really hard to just drop this discussion as so much of it was very negative to me.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#375

Post by strenholme »

krapp wrote: post #371
strenholme wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two out of three sexual assault allegations involve incidents when the person was not in an established intimate relationship with the person: https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/sexual-assault-victims/ Again, when did I ever say that “marital rape is OK”? I did not, and it’s a strawman to claim that I did.

I didn't think you were claiming marital rape was OK, I thought you were claiming it didn't exist, which is an unfortunately common belief. I misinterpreted your intent and I apologize.

Thank you for the apology. This is a complex topic which a Ycombinator thread can not do justice to, so I present this link: https://nij.ojp.gov/topics/articles/victims-and-perpetrators

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#376

Post by mirimir »

alexis_fr wrote: post #251
mirimir wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, and TFA also quotes this from her: > "Lots of people disagree about where to draw the line. But most people would want to draw a line so there is such a thing as consensual sex." Also this amazing quote from some activist: > As Catharine Mackinnon, the progenitor of the school of feminism from which this movement proceeds, once put it, "Politically, I call it rape whenever a woman has sex and feels violated." So…

This is correct. That’s what is called the MGTOW philosophy. A lot of men are disengaging. However, I have very few data to understand whether this is as new as they present it, or whether there has always been 30% of men who disengaged from the dating pool throughout history.

More useful, perhaps, would be peaceful non-violernt demonstrations. Something like mourning the coming of men and women raising children together.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#377

Post by abvdasker »

lidHanteyk wrote: post #328
abvdasker wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have sources for those numbers?

Thanks to Aumann's Agreement, I cannot convince you that the priors are well-calibrated priors without infinite regress. Do you have sources for other numbers that you would prefer be used instead?

I'm gonna take that as a no.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#378

Post by lidHanteyk »

abvdasker wrote: post #377
lidHanteyk wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks to Aumann's Agreement, I cannot convince you that the priors are well-calibrated priors without infinite regress. Do you have sources for other numbers that you would prefer be used instead?

I'm gonna take that as a no.

Sure. Take a step back and look at this with some perspective:

* Neither of us really know what's going on

* Both of us have done private research

* We came up with some numbers

* I shared my numbers, you didn't share yours

Your complaint is that I'm not delegating the numbers to some authority. My complaint is that, regardless of which authority you choose, you're still choosing an authority.

I'm not saying that I'm right; in fact, part of the point of choosing priors is to be wrong. However, when we publicize the process of selecting priors, we of course embarrass each other: If the priors were already well-known and well-agreed-upon, then by Aumann's Agreement, we would have nothing to discuss.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#379

Post by mikedilger »

hirundo wrote: post #45
mikedilger wrote: post #25

This is a very difficult issue. Most sexual assaults happen in private, so there is rarely any evidence a victim can use to convict the perpetrator. Most accusations are real, but some are questionable as to whether a crime was committed, and some accusations are false. Given there is almost never any evidence, victims are at a severe disadvantage in the innocent until proven guilty paradigm. I can understand why som…

Can you at least consider yourself outside of the camp that considers it to be "rape whenever a woman has sex and feels violated”, and feels no need for standard due process measures in campus sexual assault judgments? What would be the equivalent extremities of the opposite camp? I'm not hearing from many opponents that sexual assault should be tolerated. It's more common to hear that they should be immediately esca…

Yes I'm outside the camp you describe. I side with due process and the presumption of innocence, name supression (not calling someone out who hasn't been found guilty) and I've been against the mob justice aspect of "me too", and I've seen it and cancel culture in general as a kind of social madness. But recently I started to understand the other side better, and I wanted to share why that side feels the way that they do... it's not as mad or as illogical as I had once thought.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#380

Post by mikedilger »

fluffything wrote: post #305
mikedilger wrote: post #25

This is a very difficult issue. Most sexual assaults happen in private, so there is rarely any evidence a victim can use to convict the perpetrator. Most accusations are real, but some are questionable as to whether a crime was committed, and some accusations are false. Given there is almost never any evidence, victims are at a severe disadvantage in the innocent until proven guilty paradigm. I can understand why som…

I agree with your post that "victims are at a disadvantage", but you say that: > there is rarely any evidence while also saying that: > Most accusations are real This feels like a contradiction. We can only know whether an accusation is real or not when there is enough evidence. I think that doing extrapolation exercises based on no evidence is a bad idea.

You are correct that we cannot know. I've made some assumptions I can't prove. But I think they're most likely.
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