Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

tabletmag.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

261–270 of 387 posts

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#261

Post by avar »

jamesrcole wrote: post #247
avar wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The GP mentioned this in the context of sexism being a "tractable problem", that means it's a problem that can be solved, as opposed to an intractable problem. It can be inferred that they're proposing a mechanism by which sexism can be eradicated, not just marginally improved. Otherwise it wouldn't be a tractable problem. Perhaps I'm still misreading it, but I can't see how it can be understood differently, and how…

> The GP mentioned this in the context of sexism being a "tractable problem", that means it's a problem that can be solved, as opposed to an intractable problem. > It can be inferred that they're proposing a mechanism by which sexism can be eradicated, not just marginally improved. Otherwise it wouldn't be a tractable problem. Once again you're misrepresenting what they said. They said: "This is one of the big ways i…

Certainly for the benefit of doubt of the GP I'll concede that at this point, now that I seem to have two commentators disagreeing with me.

I'm not a native English speaker, my understanding of the word "tractable" is "solvable". E.g. arranging some blocks on my desk with the tower of Hanoi algorithm using chopsticks is a tractable problem, doing so with my hands is more tractable, but the end result is the same.

In any case, whether the GP meant "completely solved" or "partial progress can be made" I think the point I was trying to make stands regardless.

That point is that even if you say achieve 100% equality of justice among jurors regardless of the sex of the defendant, you can't say you've achieved much if any progress on sexism in general.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#262

Post by not_a_cop75 »

DisruptiveDave wrote: post #254

In my junior year of college (very early 2000s), a senior friend was accused of rape by a classmate. Within two days he had to hide out at my girlfriend's house because a large group of large athletes was on the hunt for him to beat him up. Within weeks he was expelled from school. I don't recall the police ever being contacted. Turns out the girl was ashamed she voluntarily slept with him. She admitted it to friends…

It's not just the school system. I don't dare so much as flirt with anyone in a friendly way, because that becomes fuel for a possible case. It really is to the point where outside of group settings, nothing should ever be done with the opposite sex outside of marriage itself. Whatever women's lib was trying to achieve, it begins to look more and more like Islamization daily. Not to say I hate either, but it seems they used to be opposite goal sets, but slowly they are evolving back to be one and the same. I want women to have rights, but anything where an accusation becomes instantly proof seems to throw us back towards older times of isolation.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#263

Post by bonerman69 »

wccrawford wrote: post #256
DisruptiveDave wrote: post #254

In my junior year of college (very early 2000s), a senior friend was accused of rape by a classmate. Within two days he had to hide out at my girlfriend's house because a large group of large athletes was on the hunt for him to beat him up. Within weeks he was expelled from school. I don't recall the police ever being contacted. Turns out the girl was ashamed she voluntarily slept with him. She admitted it to friends…

I was once told (very emphatically) that no woman would lie about being raped because it's such a horrible thing. I just stood agape. People like about horrible things all the time to hide things that they think are more horrible. Worse, some people don't care about anyone but themselves, and will lie for any advantage or benefit.

#BelieveAllWomen was in fact a real thing, a year ago....

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#264

Post by agumonkey »

DisruptiveDave wrote: post #254

In my junior year of college (very early 2000s), a senior friend was accused of rape by a classmate. Within two days he had to hide out at my girlfriend's house because a large group of large athletes was on the hunt for him to beat him up. Within weeks he was expelled from school. I don't recall the police ever being contacted. Turns out the girl was ashamed she voluntarily slept with him. She admitted it to friends…

I bet a few dollars that everything that is wrong about how we handle sex related issues (be it improper flirt, harassment, or more) is based on a long history of stories like this.

Too often witness are unreliable. There's a gray area where only a patient and wise (ideally) judiciary system can make sense of all this. Otherwise.. it backfires in mobthink.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#265

Post by jamesrcole »

avar wrote: post #261
jamesrcole wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The GP mentioned this in the context of sexism being a "tractable problem", that means it's a problem that can be solved, as opposed to an intractable problem. > It can be inferred that they're proposing a mechanism by which sexism can be eradicated, not just marginally improved. Otherwise it wouldn't be a tractable problem. Once again you're misrepresenting what they said. They said: "This is one of the big ways i…

Certainly for the benefit of doubt of the GP I'll concede that at this point, now that I seem to have two commentators disagreeing with me. I'm not a native English speaker, my understanding of the word "tractable" is "solvable". E.g. arranging some blocks on my desk with the tower of Hanoi algorithm using chopsticks is a tractable problem, doing so with my hands is more tractable, but the end result is the same. In…

They said much more tractable. That's a qualifier. And, they were saying it was much more tractable in comparison to racism. This says nothing specific about the degree to which it is tractable, nor that it is completely tractable.

It is misrepresenting them to claim, as you're continuing to do ("even if you say achieve 100% equality of..."), that what they said is somehow an absolute statement, or that it was some statement just about juries.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#266

Post by flippinburgers »

DoreenMichele wrote: post #221
9HZZRfNlpR wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm very sorry that you go through hard times but when you take a look at the homelessness statistics you would understand men are having it in comparison statistically speaking much harder.

It's really not that simple. https://sandiegohomelesssurvivalguide.blogspot.com/2017/07/g...

According to the article women, I guess, have it harder because:

1) Family tends to want to take care of women. Women get custody more often! 2) Women often are able to find a man willing to take care of them. 3) Peeing in bushes is hard.

With other rich quotes like "women seem this and men seem that". At most it simply proves that women have it easier.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#267

Post by cf141q5325 »

linksnapzz wrote: post #44
rayiner wrote: post #38

Meh. This is the second sexual revolution. The first go around resulted in rules and around causal sex in college that favor men and encode male expectations. Women are making clear that those rules don’t work for them and are demanding a change. If you don’t push the line on consent you have nothing to worry about.

If you have nothing to hide, then you also have nothing to worry about w.r.t, say, increased police surveillance. Funny how that works...

Since you mention it, you might be safer off just filming it. Dashcams arent legal in my jurisdiction either due to privacy concerns but people still use them.

What sounds like a crazy exaggerated joke(ok it is), there were actually cases where this happened and prevented people from being sentenced as rapists. The Gina-Lisa Lohfink case in Germany for example. The sex tape is arguably what saved these men from jail. An especially disconcerning part however is that the allegations were made after the video surfaced. So even with video proof it was a matter for a court with experts being called in to interpret the video.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#268

Post by janetacarr »

kenneth wrote: post #260
DisruptiveDave wrote: post #254

In my junior year of college (very early 2000s), a senior friend was accused of rape by a classmate. Within two days he had to hide out at my girlfriend's house because a large group of large athletes was on the hunt for him to beat him up. Within weeks he was expelled from school. I don't recall the police ever being contacted. Turns out the girl was ashamed she voluntarily slept with him. She admitted it to friends…

We should make the punishment for falsely accusing someone of rape equivalent to the punishment for rape. That's take care of the problem.

This assumes the court system is infallible though when we know it is not. Plus, I can see something like this deterring actual victims from coming forward.

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#269

Post by mschuster91 »

bonerman69 wrote: post #263
wccrawford wrote: post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was once told (very emphatically) that no woman would lie about being raped because it's such a horrible thing. I just stood agape. People like about horrible things all the time to hide things that they think are more horrible. Worse, some people don't care about anyone but themselves, and will lie for any advantage or benefit.

#BelieveAllWomen was in fact a real thing, a year ago....

As a reaction to a system where literally thousands of women's rape kits are not tested for years due to a combination of mismanagement, underfunding and understaffing, as well to structural issues such as male police officers not taking sexual assault accusations seriously or subjecting victims of assault to traumatizing questioning with no care about their mental well-being.

Back then, the status quo was "if you're a woman and you got raped, good luck getting justice".

Re: America’s New Sex Bureaucracy

#270

Post by excalibur »

kenneth wrote: post #260
DisruptiveDave wrote: post #254

In my junior year of college (very early 2000s), a senior friend was accused of rape by a classmate. Within two days he had to hide out at my girlfriend's house because a large group of large athletes was on the hunt for him to beat him up. Within weeks he was expelled from school. I don't recall the police ever being contacted. Turns out the girl was ashamed she voluntarily slept with him. She admitted it to friends…

We should make the punishment for falsely accusing someone of rape equivalent to the punishment for rape. That's take care of the problem.

....provided "rape" is defined as something other than "whatever the accuser says it is".
Post reply on HN