Live data from Hacker News

Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

non-linear-response.blogspot.com

1–10 of 42 posts

Re: Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

#2
A long-held conspiracy theory of mine: While 99%+ of those watching broadcast or cable television never have the opportunity to buy Cisco equipment for their business, and much better suited advertising channels exist (IT magazines, even TechCrunch), Cisco spends a LOT of time & money advertising on TV. (Until recently, Cisco used other brands for consumer products, e.g. Linksys!) But if it’s not to reach the consumers, why do it? Simply to “purchase” journalists and networks. If they start criticizing Cisco for its role in oppressive regimes’ censorship and e-terror campaigns, they lose a significant percent of their ad revenue.

The genius of it is, the financial ramifications are so obvious to these networks & publishers that not a single explicit word needs said; it’s not a bribe, it’s just making it lucrative to keep one’s figurative mouth shut.

Re: Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

#3
"While the liberty movements in the West are busy enough doing good job fighting off the surveillance wave at home, the totalitarian customer segment remains steadily serviced, by the virtue of civil opinion there being discarded and silenced."

That's a bold statement. I agree that liberty movements are fighting. But I don't think they are winning. We've definitely taken a few steps back in recent years. There are more cameras on every street corner and more companies are using facial recognition software to spot people as they go about their day to day business. I don't think that's progress.

Re: Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

#4
I think one of the most well known and egregious example of large scale surveillance outfit is the Stasi. It's reported that there was one informer per every 6 and a half people. Possibly the highest ratio of all known examples.

Stasiland http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stasiland is a fascinating read. And of course "The Lives of Others" is a must watch. If for no other reason than to experience an eloquent demonstration of powerful yet understated acting.

Re: Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

#5
The battle for privacy was lost during the last decade - as in "we lost the war".

http://media.ccc.de/browse/congress/2005/22C3-920-en-we_lost...

The best we can hope for in future is a transparent or sousveillance society where an informational balance of power is maintained. Currently the main bottleneck is ISPs, and these are points of weakness where top-down control can be introduced to a greater or lesser extent.

Re: Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

#6
post #2

A long-held conspiracy theory of mine: While 99%+ of those watching broadcast or cable television never have the opportunity to buy Cisco equipment for their business, and much better suited advertising channels exist (IT magazines, even TechCrunch), Cisco spends a LOT of time & money advertising on TV. (Until recently, Cisco used other brands for consumer products, e.g. Linksys!) But if it’s not to reach the consume…

That's the most crazy-ass, tinfoil hat thing I've heard in ages.

And I completely, 100% believe it. Damn. What possible alternative explanation could exist for that absurd consumer ad spend in the service of network infrastructure products? I hope someone can provide one, otherwise this will keep me awake tonight, pondering.

Re: Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

#7
This post should be required reading for anyone in West working on this technology. It's one thing to spend your life working on something of dubious benefit to humanity, it's entirely another to be directly, actively working against freedom and democracy globally.

I know of one company that used to (maybe still do?) recruit aggressively at my university, who shall remain nameless for the sake of civility, and cannot understand the students that chose to go work there despite knowing full well the business they're in.

Re: Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

#8
post #2

A long-held conspiracy theory of mine: While 99%+ of those watching broadcast or cable television never have the opportunity to buy Cisco equipment for their business, and much better suited advertising channels exist (IT magazines, even TechCrunch), Cisco spends a LOT of time & money advertising on TV. (Until recently, Cisco used other brands for consumer products, e.g. Linksys!) But if it’s not to reach the consume…

Oh come on. My completely non-technical boss looked at me a while ago and said "We should get a barracuda spam filter."

Why? Why does he even know what this is? Why does he even know that spam filters exist?

Because barracuda has their ads all over every airport I've ever been in.

The same goes for cisco. If I put in a request for funding for some network gear, my boss wants to feel like he knows a bit about what I'm spending money on. Cisco helps him feel that way. When he signs off on it, he gets a warm fuzzy because the television told him that cisco gear is the best gear and cisco gear is what he needs.

He might even object if I told him that we're going to get juniper stuff instead of cisco because juniper doesn't have ads on the TV and he's never heard of them. What are they, some generic brand? No! WE need cisco!

Re: Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

#9
post #5

The battle for privacy was lost during the last decade - as in "we lost the war". http://media.ccc.de/browse/congress/2005/22C3-920-en-we_lost... The best we can hope for in future is a transparent or sousveillance society where an informational balance of power is maintained. Currently the main bottleneck is ISPs, and these are points of weakness where top-down control can be introduced to a greater or lesser extent…

The end of privacy was a foregone conclusion: with such rapidly falling cost for video and audio hardware, the only way to keep privacy would be totalitarianism.

Re: Age of surveillance: the fish is rotting from its head

#10

This post should be required reading for anyone in West working on this technology. It's one thing to spend your life working on something of dubious benefit to humanity, it's entirely another to be directly, actively working against freedom and democracy globally. I know of one company that used to (maybe still do?) recruit aggressively at my university, who shall remain nameless for the sake of civility, and cannot…

Sadly, money motivates, and I can understand that. I still think that way about people who go to work on guided missiles and so forth. Perhaps it's a stretched simile, but I think it's like selling crack to kids to feed your family.

I don't think it's that civil to omit the company's name, it's more like letting them win. I find it interesting and useful to learn which companies are behind shady activities, as done in the article:

> The equipment, produced by Alcatel, Siemens, Cisco and others is then sold to Iran, Myanmar, Belarus and other repressive regimes, as part of normal network operator procurements.

Post reply on HN