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Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

comlab.ox.ac.uk

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Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#11

Post by kwoks »

smcl wrote: post #8

I suspect the Oxford\Cambridge undergrad interviews have less to do with assessing technical competency and more to do with providing admissions with a reason to discriminate against state-educated kids. The amount of Oxbridge intake come from private schools is disproportionately high to be due to exam results alone, and is better explained by an ingrained negative view of those with a state education or old boys ne…

I got into Cambridge without any specific 'accent' or favour. Btwn, i come from a minority group.

Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#12

Post by kwoks »

smcl wrote: post #8

I suspect the Oxford\Cambridge undergrad interviews have less to do with assessing technical competency and more to do with providing admissions with a reason to discriminate against state-educated kids. The amount of Oxbridge intake come from private schools is disproportionately high to be due to exam results alone, and is better explained by an ingrained negative view of those with a state education or old boys ne…

I got into Cambridge without any specific 'accent' or favour. Btwn, i come from a minority group.

Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#13

Post by andrew1 »

sachinag wrote: post #5

Could some kind UKer(s) please explain to this American exactly how Oxford, Cambridge, and the UK university system works? I'm familiar with what A levels are, and that you supposedly apply to a particular college at each of Oxford and Cambridge, but then I hear about university-wide "departments", and I put that in my American-style mental model. Googling hasn't helped me, but perhaps I'm being unimaginative in sear…

Only some UK universities have a collegiate system (Oxford, Cambridge, Durham, St. Andrews(?)). Most do not (I believe) and I imagine are roughly similar to US universities. At collegiate universities there is a split between what a college is responsible for, and what the university is responsible for. Lectures are university-wide, exams also are (you get your degree from the university not the college), departments belong to the university (so if the Enlgish department needs a new building then the university pays for that). All students (and staff) are affiliated to a college (you choose which college to apply to when you apply to the university, and the college decides whether to admit you). The college is responsible for their students accommodation needs, will usually provide a dining option, common room etc. The college provides teaching (so you go to the same lectures as everyone else, but your small group teaching, feedback on work etc. is organised by the college). I think those are the main distinctions.

Given that the colleges are different, this can mean it's important to choose the right one for you. For example, at Cambridge, Trinity College has an illustrious history in mathematics, and attracts excellent staff, so if you're accepted there then you might end up being taught one-on-two by a world renowned mathematician (Fields Medal winning Timothy Gowers for example). Other colleges with less of a reputation might have more trouble attracting the same type of staff. (this isn't to say that being an expert in your field makes you an excellent teacher of course...)

Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#14

Post by barry-cotter »

smcl wrote: post #8

I suspect the Oxford\Cambridge undergrad interviews have less to do with assessing technical competency and more to do with providing admissions with a reason to discriminate against state-educated kids. The amount of Oxbridge intake come from private schools is disproportionately high to be due to exam results alone, and is better explained by an ingrained negative view of those with a state education or old boys ne…

Evidence against this hypothesis; Charles went to Oxford, William to St. Andrews.

Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#15

Post by arethuza »

smcl wrote: post #8

I suspect the Oxford\Cambridge undergrad interviews have less to do with assessing technical competency and more to do with providing admissions with a reason to discriminate against state-educated kids. The amount of Oxbridge intake come from private schools is disproportionately high to be due to exam results alone, and is better explained by an ingrained negative view of those with a state education or old boys ne…

While I suspect a lot of this probably does have to do with selecting "people like us" I've also had the experience to compare my privately educated son with my own experiences in state education (at a pretty rough school).

What private schools seem particularly good at is instilling a rather outgoing self-confidence that seems pretty uncommon amongst state educated kids. Note that this is effectively orthogonal to actual capabilities - but the end result is that I suspect that a lot of privately educated kids will come across a lot better in these situations than people from state schools.

It's not fair - but to be honest that's why you pay the considerable amounts of money for private education - to give your kids an advantage.

Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#16

Post by JoachimSchipper »

viraptor wrote: post #9

I really like those questions - they seem very tricky until you think of some way to do it in a smaller subset or try to figure out the solution by doing the actual actions in your head. I think they're very different from the typical hiring interview logic puzzles you'd see in the companies, but I can't really express the difference... Then again, I can't really figure out (an optimal) solution to the second one...…

I don't really see what you mean ("3 segments" suggests asking for f(1/3) and f(2/3) to me, but that's not enough data to know anything). I'll type what I thought, which may be the same thing.

If a = f(c) then a You could recurse on the above, e.g. by measuring 1/4 + 1/8 and 1/4 + 3/8 if 1/4 Another interesting trick is measuring 1/2 + epsilon, which (almost) bisects the range with only two measurements. [EDIT^2: removed "(with negligible probability of m being in [1/2, 1/2 + epsilon] - we just hope that doesn't happen, so this doesn't work for adversarial input!). [EDIT: this actually works pretty well for non-adversarial input.]"].

[EDIT^2: I should've paid a bit more attention when writing this, thanks for the (many) corrections jacobolus!]

Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#17

Post by sabatier »

barry-cotter wrote: post #14
smcl wrote: post #8

I suspect the Oxford\Cambridge undergrad interviews have less to do with assessing technical competency and more to do with providing admissions with a reason to discriminate against state-educated kids. The amount of Oxbridge intake come from private schools is disproportionately high to be due to exam results alone, and is better explained by an ingrained negative view of those with a state education or old boys ne…

Evidence against this hypothesis; Charles went to Oxford, William to St. Andrews.

Charles did not go to Oxford. In fact, I'm pretty sure none of the current British royal family attended Oxford.

Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#18

Post by andrew1 »

smcl wrote: post #8

I suspect the Oxford\Cambridge undergrad interviews have less to do with assessing technical competency and more to do with providing admissions with a reason to discriminate against state-educated kids. The amount of Oxbridge intake come from private schools is disproportionately high to be due to exam results alone, and is better explained by an ingrained negative view of those with a state education or old boys ne…

Have you done any research on this?

Assume for a moment that the exam results of students follow a bell shaped curve and that the mean and standard deviation of exam results in the state and private sector are the same, then you would expect the proportion of state school pupils accepted by Oxbridge to be the same as the proportion in the general school system. If instead we assume that the mean in the private sector is higher then you would no longer expect the same proportion to be accepted, and indeed that disproportionately many private sector students would get in.

I'm not saying this is the case (although private school students probably do do better in exams on average), but without knowing anything about the situation how can you accuse them of discrimination? The 'oh, I saw a really good person get turned away' argument is silly. Some colleges only offer a few places for some subjects but are presented with 20+ students who all have predicted straight As, good UCAS forms etc. It's inevitable that some good students will not get in, and it doesn't imply discrimination.

Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#19

Post by ig1 »

smcl wrote: post #8

I suspect the Oxford\Cambridge undergrad interviews have less to do with assessing technical competency and more to do with providing admissions with a reason to discriminate against state-educated kids. The amount of Oxbridge intake come from private schools is disproportionately high to be due to exam results alone, and is better explained by an ingrained negative view of those with a state education or old boys ne…

There's no statistical evidence showing this is the case. Students from high performing schools are disproportionately likely to apply to Oxbridge, but adjusting for academic performance there's no indication that Oxbridge discriminates.

Pretty much everyone applying to Oxbridge is applying with top grades, plenty of exceptional candidates from both state and private sector schools get rejected.

If you want to understand the real issues in social mobility I suggest reading the Milburn report which I think is one of the best reports I've ever seen a government produce: http://www.bis.gov.uk/assets/biscore/corporate/migratedd/pub...

Re: Oxford Undergrad CS Admission Interview Problems

#20

Post by andrew1 »

sabatier wrote: post #17
barry-cotter wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Evidence against this hypothesis; Charles went to Oxford, William to St. Andrews.

Charles did not go to Oxford. In fact, I'm pretty sure none of the current British royal family attended Oxford.

Indeed, Charles attended Trinity College, Cambridge.
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