Earlier quoted context omitted.
> If you need to travel long distances, there's little substitute for an airplane. The emphasis here isn't on substitute, it's on "need". Not many people need to travel long distances on a regular basis; they're just made to believe they need do.
People traveling, the tourism that is so often bemoaned, is a huge part of the connections between countries, a huge part of diversity and understanding. A world with greatly reduced air travel is a more insular and less understanding world.
Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
241–250 of 325 posts
Re: Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
#242"Over all, air travel accounts for about 2.5 percent of global carbon dioxide emissions — a far smaller share than emissions from passenger cars or power plants." 2.5% means we should focus on reducing somewhere else in the near term.
Air travel is more important because of the water vapor far more than the carbon. The week following 9/11 was dramatically different. NASA recorded the change in daily temperature range. Less significantly, we had crystal clear skys where I live - for a week! Water vapor can also seed cloud formation. Air travel causes a daily cycle in this, which might just keep more heat in at night. You can look at data and see th…
Re: Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
#243Earlier quoted context omitted.
People traveling, the tourism that is so often bemoaned, is a huge part of the connections between countries, a huge part of diversity and understanding. A world with greatly reduced air travel is a more insular and less understanding world.
Ticking off the number of countries you've visited is hardly a benevolent hobby. You can learn the history, culture, language, traditions, etc. of any country by opening a book, if that's really what you're interested in.
Is this a serious assertion? You think I can learn the culture of, say, Japan, from a book as well as by actually living there for a short period and experiencing it?
This strikes me as woefully naive. Learning things from books, from a distance is fine and good, but there's no true substitute for being there, for experiencing a thing in person.
Re: Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
#244Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah, this reads very much as the same kind of moral panic we recently endured over plastic straws. Air travel does emit a ton of carbon per person, but on the whole we're better off putting effort into making renewables cheaper and greening up the agriculture industry. Not that we shouldn't put pressure on the airlines to put R&D into lowering emissions but pretending this is something people can fix by "flying a li…
There's nothing wrong in picking the low-hanging fruit. Pick enough of these, and you start seeing a difference with minimal cost.
Re: Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
#245Earlier quoted context omitted.
(And little substitute for burning hydrocarbons as airplane propellant. Energy density and stuff like fire safety really really matters in aviation.) Totally agree that air travel is one of the last places to look for carbon savings. That said, carbon offset taxes should be applied where they are not already. The market can price this cost in and judge whether the value is there, if the incentives are structured corr…
An area of research that I don't hear much about is creating hydrocarbon fuels for applications that really need them, like airplanes. Essentially, using hydrocarbons as a chemical battery instead of an out-of-the-ground energy source. As with any contributor to climate change, the issue is not burning the fuel, the issue is that the fuel is bringing new carbon out of the ground into today's carbon cycle. Hydrocarbon…
Oh yes, I was going to comment on exactly that point.
> The chemistry is complicated
That depends on which type of fuel you are talking about. If you can use Methane (AKA Natural Gas), then you could use the Sabatier reaction (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabatier_reaction). You need CO2 (which is what we want to remove) and Hydrogen (which is the energy consuming part). Then you have to compress it (more energy).
The advantage of adding CO2 to the mix(instead of just burning hydrogen) is that it becomes much easier to store and you have decent energy density.
Of course, that's not Jet-A. If you really need that (turbines don't care too much, but logistics and storage will care), then you need to use something else. Eg. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fischer%E2%80%93Tropsch_proces...
As I understand it, that's what the Navy was struggling against.
But forget about the energy costs, think about human labor costs. Because if you can reduce labor to zero and have these things be self-sufficient, then we really don't care about energy costs. Stick a bunch of these fuel facilities wherever they will fit, power them with whatever renewables are available, wait a bit, then come back to collect.
I think the first large scale application will actually come from SpaceX. They need to figure out fuel manufacturing for a Mars return trip.
Re: Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
#246If you need to travel long distances, there's little substitute for an airplane. If air travel accounts for less emissions than passenger cars, and if the top 15 polluting large container ships produce as much (noxious oxides of nitrogen and sulphur) pollution as all cars, then we need to fix shipping first. And if you look at a lot of the crap that is being shipped, it's stuff we just don't need. A lot of things are…
> ... then we need to fix shipping first. The problem with this logic is that we aren't one person looking at a bug tracker queue deciding one to tackle next. We are a civilization . We need to fix everything all at once, as quickly as possible. If shipping is a problem, fix it now . If air travel is a problem, fix it now . If grid electric is a problem, fix it now . If automotive emissions are a problem, fix it now…
Re: Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
#247Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't follow what you're saying. Is it that other emissions than CO2 are more important to fight? Well, that change is already happening with the ongoing big change towards LNG as the preferred fuel for shipping. But when it comes to reducing CO2 emissions, outside of improving energy efficiency, it seems nobody has anything even remotely viable today. That goes both for deep sea shipping and for most air travel.
There's always sailing, although it's a bit laborious, and fission has a good record at sea :-)
The German company SkySails has been working for years on kites that can reduce fuel use on large ships. I think at some point we'll see alternative (renewable) energy taking over shipping as it is gradually taking over other domains.
Re: Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
#248I fly fairly frequently to California from NY for work, lately after reading a few articles like this, I wonder if I should put my foot down to my manager and tell them that I'm not going to anymore until flying is less terrible for the atmosphere. I don't think I'll be fired for that, and even if I were I'd probably be able to find another job without too much trouble at this point, but I feel a bit bad for people d…
I did change. I dropped from 35-40 flights in 12 months (really not good, in more ways than one) to 3-4. Still too many. But getting there.
However, my wife is Chinese so of course she wants to see her family once a year. That means at least four flights. However we usually take the opportunity to travel whilst we're in China which adds another two flights each.
To balance this, we usually try to holiday in the UK when we can, which of course means we don't need to fly.
Re: Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
#249Earlier quoted context omitted.
> If you need to travel long distances, there's little substitute for an airplane. The emphasis here isn't on substitute, it's on "need". Not many people need to travel long distances on a regular basis; they're just made to believe they need do.
People traveling, the tourism that is so often bemoaned, is a huge part of the connections between countries, a huge part of diversity and understanding. A world with greatly reduced air travel is a more insular and less understanding world.
That's dubious and far more benign than the consequences of a world with climate change.
Re: Air Travel Emissions Vastly Outpace Predictions
#250Earlier quoted context omitted.
Vastly more business travel is done for sales or sales-support purposes than attending conference purposes. Humans are tribal animals; we respond to communications in person better than over video conference and we tend to trust people with whom we've shared meals and drinks. Arguing that that just shouldn't be isn't likely to change anything about business behavior. I get on airplanes across oceans because it's effe…
Well, to be blunt, so what? That sucks for sales stuff, it's not like I said conferences are the only things that need to change. Maybe the practices there need to change there just like for conferences and other stuff. Nobody said it's easy or nice or effective or whatever for humans to do long distance. Just that you need to start sacrificing somewhere and I sure as heck find it more reasonable and humane to start…
No chance that businesses will stop paying for people to travel. And their budgets are much bigger than individuals visiting family. Take a look at the entire private jet market - basically a very small wedge of HNWs and lots of executives flying for business.