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Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

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Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#31

Post by knz »

Simulacra wrote: post #17

What I know is that before ACA, my health insurance was about $150 a month. Now it’s $650 a month. I can’t afford to subsidize other people’s bad choices and inability to pay. Health insurance should not be robbing Peter to pay Paul, we should return to an open market place.

Is the ACA responsible for the rise? Personally, my health insurance rates (for a family plan offered through my employer of ~1,000 people) were increasing by 5-10% per year before the ACA and have been more stable since (3-5% increases per year).

Its currently at a total of $22,000/year (between employer and employee contributions) - that's equivalent to $35,000 dollars in my country of birth (New Zealand), or 700% of what the total tax on the median income is. Somehow, kiwis get all of the functions of government for 14% of what health insurance costs in America. It's insane and reminds me every enrolment season of how poor the ROI on healthcare dollars is in the US.

Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#32

Post by godzillabrennus »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #28
sneak wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Torn down by whom? There is a whole system of laws and companies and staff that would object to such a dictatorial move. We agree that it’s fucked. We likely disagree on where it needs to go, and possibly on how it needs to get there. Actionable steps to improve are what is needed, especially now that stance on healthcare regulation has become a point of political identity in the USA. I think it will probably get wor…

60% of Americans believe the government (in some form) should ensure healthcare for its citizens (per Pew Research). 70% of Americans support Medicare for All. We’re going single payer (Medicare For All), it’s just a matter of when (the younger you are, the more you’re likely to support it). https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/03/most-contin... https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/412545-70-...

Makes sense to go single payer (and I tend to be pretty libertarian over all). Insurance is about having a pool of payers large enough for offsetting costs. The larger the pool in a nation with population growth the higher probability that a larger pool will be better. The largest pool is everyone.

I don’t like calling it a human right. That implies the doctors are enslaved to provide care. No rational and highly intelligent person will pursue medicine as a career if it’s going to require 12 years of education before conscription into unpaid labor.

Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#33

Post by [deleted] »

godzillabrennus wrote: post #32
toomuchtodo wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

60% of Americans believe the government (in some form) should ensure healthcare for its citizens (per Pew Research). 70% of Americans support Medicare for All. We’re going single payer (Medicare For All), it’s just a matter of when (the younger you are, the more you’re likely to support it). https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/03/most-contin... https://thehill.com/hilltv/what-americas-thinking/412545-70-...

Makes sense to go single payer (and I tend to be pretty libertarian over all). Insurance is about having a pool of payers large enough for offsetting costs. The larger the pool in a nation with population growth the higher probability that a larger pool will be better. The largest pool is everyone. I don’t like calling it a human right. That implies the doctors are enslaved to provide care. No rational and highly int…

[deleted]

Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#34

Post by Ididntdothis »

no_opinions wrote: post #29

In European countries I visited, primarily Scandinavian ones, they take such pride in their social system. If some European countries is any example, publicly run healthcare can incentivize innovation in private health insurances. Apparently EU citizens (and visa holders?) get a healthcare card that's portable across EU. Is this true? Any Europeans healthcare users have opinions on the healthcare system there? Any wi…

"Apparently EU citizens (and visa holders?) get a healthcare card that's portable across EU. Is this true? "

I don't think so. The systems are very different. But if you get sick in another country they won't rip you off like they doing in the US. My sister from Germany was charged $1200 when her daughter had a fever in NYC. She talked to a doctor for 5 minutes and got an antibiotic.

Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#35

Post by tempsy »

ryanobjc wrote: post #18
tempsy wrote: post #4

Even the bronze plan (which was always compliant) is terrible, though. Depending on the state and plan, but it’s around $400/month and $7500 deductible for a single adult, so you’re paying more than $12k out of pocket before you get anything, except some very basic preventative care. Our health care system is a joke.

Not true. Even the bronze plans cover doctor visits with just copays, no deductible to be met. Copays count towards deductibles. Now when you need hospital services, surgery, emergency, yes the deductible is formidable. After that they cover at some amount, 80% typically. So the notion you have to pay $12k first is a blatant lie. The bronze plans are akin to what low end employers used to/still offer. It’s better tha…

I said “except some very basic preventative care.”

So you’re paying $12k/year for a 30m checkup and potentially still have to shell out $30 for a copay. Not sure why that doesn’t illustrate my point exactly.

Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#36

Post by Ididntdothis »

Simulacra wrote: post #17

What I know is that before ACA, my health insurance was about $150 a month. Now it’s $650 a month. I can’t afford to subsidize other people’s bad choices and inability to pay. Health insurance should not be robbing Peter to pay Paul, we should return to an open market place.

Before ACA you couldn't get insurance if you had preconditions and they would often drop you if actually got sick. ACA needs improvement but things sucked long before.

Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#37

Post by thomasjudge »

sambull wrote: post #2

Guaranteed strategy for a progressive wave 2020 and a democratic president. Expect massive executive action to address climate change and end corruption. There's nothing more evident than the greed of the insurance companies, it cuts bipartisan. Finally the hope of adults in the reigns again

Everybody likes a simplistic explanation of the high cost of health care like "blame the insurance industry" but the reality is more complicated. Yes they are middlemen and need to make profits which adds cost. But look at doctor salaries, particularly specialists, many of whom make over $1m/yr. Look at testing costs, often run by private companies (sometimes owned by the doctors who order the tests) that also need to make a profit. Look at the costs of hospital and hospital systems whose administrative and facilities costs rival that of higher education. And not to mention the whole pharmaceutical-industrial complex. Reducing healthcare costs is going to have to happen at the input side of the industry, not just by taking out payer inefficiencies.

Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#38

Post by brian-armstrong »

sneak wrote: post #15
Ididntdothis wrote: post #6

The US system really needs to be torn down and rebuilt from scratch. Stories like this simply shouldn’t happen. There is almost no way as a patient to ensure your coverage is sufficient besides having a lot of money in case. It’s insane and hard to understand how anyone can defend this. With the lack of information the patient has nobody should talk about free markets. A functioning market requires that all participa…

Torn down by whom? There is a whole system of laws and companies and staff that would object to such a dictatorial move. We agree that it’s fucked. We likely disagree on where it needs to go, and possibly on how it needs to get there. Actionable steps to improve are what is needed, especially now that stance on healthcare regulation has become a point of political identity in the USA. I think it will probably get wor…

> Torn down by whom?

Trump can and should do it. He's one of the few in Washington who isn't actually owned by the Pharma companies.

Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#39

Post by Ididntdothis »

u801e wrote: post #24
Ididntdothis wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, that was a good thing. But it didn't address the cost side.

I wonder if that would have been the case had the public health option been part of the ACA?

the public option would basically have been Medicare for All.

Re: Health Insurance That Doesn’t Cover the Bills Has Flooded the Market

#40

Post by seppin »

brian-armstrong wrote: post #38
sneak wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Torn down by whom? There is a whole system of laws and companies and staff that would object to such a dictatorial move. We agree that it’s fucked. We likely disagree on where it needs to go, and possibly on how it needs to get there. Actionable steps to improve are what is needed, especially now that stance on healthcare regulation has become a point of political identity in the USA. I think it will probably get wor…

> Torn down by whom? Trump can and should do it. He's one of the few in Washington who isn't actually owned by the Pharma companies.

> He's one of the few in Washington who isn't actually owned by the Pharma companies.

IF that's true, it's because they haven't offered him anything yet.

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