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Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

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Re: Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

#11

Post by imglorp »

jacobush wrote: post #10
imglorp wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

DNS working in a corporate IT environment is a surprise. Often, clients are issued an internal DNS server via DHCP, and outbound DNS to arbitrary servers is blocked. This helps mitigate DNS hijacking and also allows some additional outbound domain filtering and logging.

Oh, yes, DNS is an internal DNS. You can't change it. I meant, it's the only way to "trickle leak" data without it going through the filtering proxy. But who knows, maybe the DNS requests are logged too, but they don't seem to be filtered. Edit: they are filtered. Suspicious names go to 127.0.0.1

You can leak names can't you? Wouldn't kinda-short-secret-message.foo.example.com make its way eventually to the authoritative server for example.com, as long as it's not too sketchy a domain?

Re: Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

#12

Post by jacobush »

imglorp wrote: post #11
jacobush wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, yes, DNS is an internal DNS. You can't change it. I meant, it's the only way to "trickle leak" data without it going through the filtering proxy. But who knows, maybe the DNS requests are logged too, but they don't seem to be filtered. Edit: they are filtered. Suspicious names go to 127.0.0.1

You can leak names can't you? Wouldn't kinda-short-secret-message.foo.example.com make its way eventually to the authoritative server for example.com, as long as it's not too sketchy a domain?

Yep, that works.

Re: Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

#13

Post by archergod »

noname120 wrote: post #3

> This will work behind many NATs and firewalls, but not all. While this is an interesting concept, the hard part in NAT traversal is getting it to work on all the possible NAT types. In particular, I believe that this method doesn't work for symmetric NAT devices[1], which are widespread in corporate environments. It's not a surprise that this idea from 2010 didn't take off, ICE/TURN are still kings. [1] These devic…

2010? Samy (author of pwnat) is the person jailed for hacking MySpace using this Code. He write this code in 2005 or 2007 something, He upload to his site in 2010, but this code is very old, and I was the first one to compile it on windows back than. It works, but for limited devices back then. It is very respectable code in itself.

Re: Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

#15

Post by mempko »

jgeralnik wrote: post #2

The really cool part about this is that the server does not need to know the client's ip address. Instead a new original form of ICMP hole punching is used to allow any client to punch the NAT so that the server can dynamically learn the client ip, and then regular UDP hole punching is used.

I'm sad that P2P never took off in the messaging world and now we are stuck with servers storing data even if it's E2E encrypted.

I use NAT traversal for Firestr (http://firestr.com) back in 2013 though this is still cool because of the ICMP hole punching. I'll have to see if I can incorporate that.

Re: Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

#16

Post by knd775 »

archergod wrote: post #13
noname120 wrote: post #3

> This will work behind many NATs and firewalls, but not all. While this is an interesting concept, the hard part in NAT traversal is getting it to work on all the possible NAT types. In particular, I believe that this method doesn't work for symmetric NAT devices[1], which are widespread in corporate environments. It's not a surprise that this idea from 2010 didn't take off, ICE/TURN are still kings. [1] These devic…

2010? Samy (author of pwnat) is the person jailed for hacking MySpace using this Code. He write this code in 2005 or 2007 something, He upload to his site in 2010, but this code is very old, and I was the first one to compile it on windows back than. It works, but for limited devices back then. It is very respectable code in itself.

He didn't "[hack] MySpace using this code". He just used XSS.

Re: Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

#17

Post by imglorp »

mempko wrote: post #15
jgeralnik wrote: post #2

The really cool part about this is that the server does not need to know the client's ip address. Instead a new original form of ICMP hole punching is used to allow any client to punch the NAT so that the server can dynamically learn the client ip, and then regular UDP hole punching is used.

I'm sad that P2P never took off in the messaging world and now we are stuck with servers storing data even if it's E2E encrypted. I use NAT traversal for Firestr ( http://firestr.com ) back in 2013 though this is still cool because of the ICMP hole punching. I'll have to see if I can incorporate that.

There's some progress. See https://libp2p.io eg.

Re: Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

#18

Post by big_chungus »

imglorp wrote: post #9
jacobush wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All 3 corporate firewalls I have been behind have been HTTP only. No actual internet connection. (Except for DNS, which worked.)

DNS working in a corporate IT environment is a surprise. Often, clients are issued an internal DNS server via DHCP, and outbound DNS to arbitrary servers is blocked. This helps mitigate DNS hijacking and also allows some additional outbound domain filtering and logging.

And of course, with the advent of DNS over HTTPS, this is no longer as effective. I can still access blocked sites and get around logging, I just have to set up a tunnel to cloudflare.

Re: Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

#19

Post by big_chungus »

archergod wrote: post #14
oriettaxx wrote: post #6

I had a quick test, not working for me many previous comments about this script https://hn.algolia.com/?q=pwnat

You will have better luck with IPv6 if needed why bother for NAT traversing . IPv6 just works without it.

Only because IPv6 doesn't need NAT theoretically. In practice, most people are stuck using it because the router doesn't hand a public-facing IP to most clients. When building an application, you still need it.

Re: Pwnat – Autonomous Nat Traversal (2010)

#20

Post by lozaning »

knd775 wrote: post #16
archergod wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2010? Samy (author of pwnat) is the person jailed for hacking MySpace using this Code. He write this code in 2005 or 2007 something, He upload to his site in 2010, but this code is very old, and I was the first one to compile it on windows back than. It works, but for limited devices back then. It is very respectable code in itself.

He didn't "[hack] MySpace using this code". He just used XSS.

He's still my hero though!
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