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How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

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Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This is the evil of fiscal policy. Inflation is targeted not at 2%, but 2% plus erasing all the non-fiscal economoc gains of improved technology. This is a very confused comment. The part that's coherent enough to clearly identify what is wrong is that it refers to “fiscal policy” when it means “monetary policy”, which is the policy targeted at particular inflation rates. But even aside from that, the whole claim i…

The comment may be poorly worded, but the point is sound. Every bit of technological progress or economic optimization should result in naturally decreasing prices, just as we've come to expect in the technology sector. This goes for both offshoring in general as well as Walmart's replacement of locally-run businesses. Lower consumer prices would help make up for the reduced demand for labor. But rather than this bei…

> Every bit of technological progress or economic optimization should result in naturally decreasing prices

Not in dollar terms, especially when dollars are being deliverately managed so that the dollar cost of a labor hour increases over time.

In terms of labor-hours, sure.

> Lower consumer prices would help make up for the reduced demand for labor.

No, lower nominal (dollar) prices would not. Lower real prices are an incoherent concept. Lower labor-hour-equivalent prices would if and only if lower labor demand meant equal employment but reduced hours, otherwise it would just exacerbate the tangible inequality resulting from reduced labor demand.

> But rather than this being allowed to just happen, the overt policy is to keep labor from realizing these gains so that everyone keeps working "full time".

But, it's not: that's not what targeting low positive inflation is. That would only be the overt policy if there was an overt policy to reatrict real wage gains.

While I do think (at least large portions of) one of the two major parties is actively and deliberately pursuing policies with that goal, it's very much not an overt policy.

Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#62
post #18

> At the same time, higher prices of garlic — they soared 53% — actually illustrate tariffs working as intended. > China had been the biggest exporter of garlic to the U.S. and domestic garlic growers have long argued they were being undercut by cheaper Chinese competition. Now that Chinese garlic faces higher tariffs, domestic companies can charge higher prices. Domestic companies being able to charge higher prices…

What is 55% higher though - from $0.50 to $0.76 per bulb? Garlic doesn't seem like an elastic enough good where $0.25 would make a difference. It's a staple food in almost every American household. With that being said it's sad to hear that so many people purchase Chinese produce.

One company I worked at imported broccoli from China to their factory on the eastern side of Canada, for products intended for distribution across all of Canada, Mexico, and the US.

Even with constant quality issues and recalls[1], there just weren't many other options out there. For sufficiently large orders, it's hard to secure consistent sourcing more locally. China constitutes half of the world's product, India a majority of the rest, and every other country rolls up to a very minority stake[2]. I was working on raw materials supply chain optimization, and broccoli in particular (and produce in general) was the bane of my work.

I don't know much about the wider produce supply chain, but it was really unexpected when I started just how much fresh produce we imported from China, and how it wasn't even necessarily a cost-driven factor.

[1] These consisted virtually entirely of supplier-side recalls that before production or shortly after, and at least during my tenure did not result in any customer-facing recalls. But our production/distribution process did account for enough capacity padding to allow for that, and an incredible amount of production waste.

[2] https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/countries-growing-the-mo...

Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#63
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's sad that food has to travel long distances to be purchased at reasonable prices when it's grown relatively nearby. To put the shoe on a different foot. The Dominican Republic produces a lot of tomatoes. But they lack a lot of the infrastructure and machinery that both the US and Mexico have. Shops there sell Mexico and US tomatoes when there's a tomato field ten or twenty miles away. Those fields truly can't com…

That is why the argument is made for freedom of movement of labour. If you could have cheaper labour in America, you would have the best of both worlds. But of course you’d have people complaining their jobs are being stolen. We can’t have our cake and eat it too.

You'd also often be forcing people to leave their communities and families, because the right job for them was somewhere else.

It feels weird to unthinkingly sacrifice valuable life preferences at the altar of Economic Efficiency Uber Alles.

Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is why the argument is made for freedom of movement of labour. If you could have cheaper labour in America, you would have the best of both worlds. But of course you’d have people complaining their jobs are being stolen. We can’t have our cake and eat it too.

You'd also often be forcing people to leave their communities and families, because the right job for them was somewhere else. It feels weird to unthinkingly sacrifice valuable life preferences at the altar of Economic Efficiency Uber Alles.

What do you mean by 'the right job' and why would it 'force' people to leave their communities?

Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The comment may be poorly worded, but the point is sound. Every bit of technological progress or economic optimization should result in naturally decreasing prices, just as we've come to expect in the technology sector. This goes for both offshoring in general as well as Walmart's replacement of locally-run businesses. Lower consumer prices would help make up for the reduced demand for labor. But rather than this bei…

> Every bit of technological progress or economic optimization should result in naturally decreasing prices Not in dollar terms, especially when dollars are being deliverately managed so that the dollar cost of a labor hour increases over time. In terms of labor-hours, sure. > Lower consumer prices would help make up for the reduced demand for labor. No, lower nominal (dollar) prices would not. Lower real prices are…

> Not in dollar terms, especially when dollars are being deliverately managed so that the dollar cost of a labor hour increases over time.

This is sophomoric relativism - achieving lower day-to-day prices is exactly how market competition works. It's tautological to justify a policy of changing the value of a dollar by rejecting analysis in terms of an unchanged dollar. When creating a new variable, you have to analyze it in terms of existing variables.

> lower nominal (dollar) prices would not [help make up for the reduced demand for labor]

It very clearly would if businesses said "we're going to reduce everyone's hours by 20%" while everyone's expenses went down 20% - everyone's budget would remain the same.

I'll give you that this won't happen so pleasantly uniformly. But posit E who remains employed, and U who is laid off. If the expenses of four such E's go down, they now have extra money to spend locally to create a new job for U. Whereas if the E's expenses remain the same, then U's only options to get money are to head towards where it is being printed or compete with the E's in a race to the bottom (which is why the price of easily-interchangeable labor is now set by "minimum wage" rather than the market).

> that's not what targeting low positive inflation is.

An explicit goal of inflationary monetary policy is to drive "full employment". So yes, pushing everyone to keep working full time is one of its overt goals. A goal that is regressive in the face of needing ever-less labor.

I'm obviously not going to convince you on the merits of this, especially in a few comments, and that's fine. It's just fundamentally dishonest to discard a political viewpoint by condescending from a paradigm that rules out said political viewpoint by construction.

Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#66
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Florida has a fuckton of strawberry fields. I'm about 1-3 counties away from the major producers. In major grocery chains around me, it's all California and Mexico strawberries. You have no idea how angry that makes me.

Who eats the Floridian strawberries?

I definitely have seen Florida strawberries in Georgia. (Georgia also grows strawberries, although not that many.)

Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#67
post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Florida has a fuckton of strawberry fields. I'm about 1-3 counties away from the major producers. In major grocery chains around me, it's all California and Mexico strawberries. You have no idea how angry that makes me.

Who eats the Floridian strawberries?

Nobody knows...

Just kidding. To my knowledge a lot go to processing, not consumer consumption. Typically these are also labeled as "ugly" because they're not always your traditional strawberry shape. Similar, Florida oranges were mostly juicing oranges, not consumption. Though greenery has really fucked up that market sector.

I just don't appreciate the whole "look" based market we have in the states. I think it's as stupid as stupid gets. A majority of food prices are due to people not wanting their food to "look" a certain way. Even though that look has zero correlation to taste. Which, typically, the ugly ones have more flavor. Like, the best beefsteak tomato looks like a hideous tumor. God as my witness, they have a great taste. It's good enough to just slice and eat by itself. But then the pretty beefsteak tomatoes are a watery disaster of sadness.

Just me ranting away about the terrible disconnect a majority of the population has to their food. It's really sad. There's really no cure to it unless the fed mandates Victory Gardens. Which, I'm totally for. The only big government action I'll approve is the fed saying "If you have a yard, you must cultivate 25% of it minimum as a Victory Garden or face penalty of death." A day worth celebrating.

Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#68
post #62
post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is 55% higher though - from $0.50 to $0.76 per bulb? Garlic doesn't seem like an elastic enough good where $0.25 would make a difference. It's a staple food in almost every American household. With that being said it's sad to hear that so many people purchase Chinese produce.

One company I worked at imported broccoli from China to their factory on the eastern side of Canada, for products intended for distribution across all of Canada, Mexico, and the US. Even with constant quality issues and recalls[1], there just weren't many other options out there. For sufficiently large orders, it's hard to secure consistent sourcing more locally. China constitutes half of the world's product, India a…

Maybe we should reallocate some of the corn, wheat, and soybean subsidies to domestic vegetable production.

Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#69
post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd also often be forcing people to leave their communities and families, because the right job for them was somewhere else. It feels weird to unthinkingly sacrifice valuable life preferences at the altar of Economic Efficiency Uber Alles.

What do you mean by 'the right job' and why would it 'force' people to leave their communities?

I'm going to change up the countries so there's less emotional value associated.

Why should Polish people leave their country so they can find work in England? In theory, countries should be self-sufficient enough to where only niche based jobs should have such movement. I'm talking about highly specialized stuff. But when it comes to generic labor, why? Farming? Building houses? The fact people want to leave one country for another just for basic jobs is kind of messed up. I feel both countries are to blame forcing people to leave their homeland. One needs to get their fucking shit together and/or quit punishing a demographic because said gov wants to become a more service oriented country, the other country needs to stop creating incentives for such actions to become easily profitable on a large scale basis.

Countries need to be self-sufficient with their own population. One population sacrificing its people for the good of another is not sustainable, no matter how you slice or dice it.

Re: How prices changed at a Walmart in a year

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who eats the Floridian strawberries?

I definitely have seen Florida strawberries in Georgia. (Georgia also grows strawberries, although not that many.)

That's because you lot focus on peaches. Which, I mean, yea... Only good reason to risk getting a bs speeding ticket in Georgia is for a peach run.
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