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Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

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Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#111

Post by Merrill »

When crops are removed from the land, more complex fertilizers must be used to replace the minerals. A good example is sulfur. The sulfur removed had been replenished by acid rain. Once scrubbers were applied to remove sulfur from coal plant emissions, farmers needed to monitor and replenish sulfur levels by sulfur fertilizer.

"Seeking high yields, the reduction of acid rain and the need for sulfur" - https://www.farmprogress.com/management/seeking-high-yields-...

The bottom line is that agriculture is mining, and any elements that are removed in crops must be replaced. Adequate sulfur levels are particularly important to cruciferous vegetables.

Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#112

Post by wiml »

NickM wrote: post #55

Something that has puzzled me recently: how is anyone supposed to get the daily recommended amount of potassium? If you look at foods like bananas that are supposed to be good sources of it, you still need to eat something like eleven bananas a day to get enough (according to US recommended daily intakes, anyway). At least with the minerals mentioned in this posting, you can fall back on supplements if you need to...…

There's a nice table here: https://health.gov/dietaryguidelines/2015/guidelines/appendi...

Quite a lot of common staples (eg: potatoes, greens, vegetables, pulses) have a fair amount of potassium, if you look at the "potassium in a standard portion" column (and remember these are fairly small portions, the assumption being that a meal has a portion of several different things).

Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#113

Post by 01100011 »

tastyfreeze wrote: post #82

This happened due to extermination of soil life through modern farming practices of heavy tilling, fertilizing and monoculture crops. Dead soil is more susceptible to erosion and requires ever increasing amounts of synthetic fertilizer to grow anything. More soil has been lost from the US than the amount of food that has been produced. Soil fertility can be returned to historical levels by changing farming practices…

Not exactly disagreeing with you, but it seems like increasing yields and inadequate fertilization focusing on macronutrients would also explain the drop. If I grow crops that preferentially absorb certain minerals and then take away most of the vegetable matter from the plot, the soil content of the absorbed minerals is going to drop without something to replenish it. Now, I'm not saying soil bacteria and mychorrhizal networks can't pull minerals from the underlying bedrock and transport it to the top layer, but even assuming they did, I would think high-yield farming would tax their ability to keep up with mineral outflows.

Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#114

Post by mythrwy »

tastyfreeze wrote: post #82

This happened due to extermination of soil life through modern farming practices of heavy tilling, fertilizing and monoculture crops. Dead soil is more susceptible to erosion and requires ever increasing amounts of synthetic fertilizer to grow anything. More soil has been lost from the US than the amount of food that has been produced. Soil fertility can be returned to historical levels by changing farming practices…

I think it also happens because of synthetic fertilizers (and possibly modern genetics).

It's a race to grow as big a product in as short of time as possible which causes the mineral ratios to be different.

A tomato which takes months to grow and ripens on the vine has more time to assimilate minerals than a tomato that is "pushed" with synthetic fertilizers, then snatched off the vine unripened and ripened with ethylene gas in transport.

Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#115

Post by 01100011 »

wil421 wrote: post #60
all_usernames wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Organic farming includes crop rotation, fertilizer, soil quality, and erosion control standards that would hypothetically affect mineral contents. Monoculture (conventional corn or soybean for example) uses huge amounts of synthetic fertilizer to increase yields per acre far beyond what the soil can naturally sustain. Wide swaths of American farmland has lost literally feet of topsoil over the past 50 years. The soil…

Corn and soybeans are most definitely rotated. Peanuts are a common nitrogen fixer and Alfalfa is great too. >This crop rotation benefits both alfalfa and wheat/barley/corn. On the one hand, cereals tend to decrease the development of weeds, leaving the field free for the alfalfa cultivation. On the other hand, there are findings suggesting that corn following alfalfa yields approximately 10% more than corn following…

Peanuts increase nitrogen and probably no nothing for micronutrients. They may allow time for the underlying rock to transfer minerals to the soil which are consumed more heavily by the opposing crops, but they probably won't do anything for the issue reported in TFA.

Having more corn doesn't mean that the corn or soil has more micronutrients. Corn is nitrogen heavy, so rotation makes sense if yields are all you care about.

Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#116

Post by patientplatypus »

As I said in a previous thread:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20799295

---

*-4 points by patientplatypus 18 days ago | parent | favorite | on: The Next Recession Will Be About Sovereign Debt

The next recession will be caused by poor crop yields due to environmental destruction. It will also cause famines and wars globally.

---

We have maybe one or two years left, up to five maybe if we're lucky, until the entire social system collapses. It will be dark and sad and scary.

I'm sorry you guys.

Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#117

Post by [deleted] »

fbonetti wrote: post #109
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #6

Growing food has turned into an engineering problem where people think you solve it by investing the least possible resources into it. Whatever the consumer will buy and you can produce as cheaply as possible wins the day. Our tasteless vegetables are like cheap Bose (no highs, no lows, must be Bose) speakers or pressed paper furniture at Walmart. On the surface they look like a vegetable should look, but the taste,…

> Growing food has turned into an engineering problem where people think you solve it by investing the least possible resources into it. This is not a bad thing. Food is so abundant that globally, more people are obese than underweight. This is pretty remarkable considering that for all of human history, up until recently, periods of mass starvation was the norm.

[deleted]

Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#118

Post by caiobegotti »

fbonetti wrote: post #109
JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #6

Growing food has turned into an engineering problem where people think you solve it by investing the least possible resources into it. Whatever the consumer will buy and you can produce as cheaply as possible wins the day. Our tasteless vegetables are like cheap Bose (no highs, no lows, must be Bose) speakers or pressed paper furniture at Walmart. On the surface they look like a vegetable should look, but the taste,…

> Growing food has turned into an engineering problem where people think you solve it by investing the least possible resources into it. This is not a bad thing. Food is so abundant that globally, more people are obese than underweight. This is pretty remarkable considering that for all of human history, up until recently, periods of mass starvation was the norm.

Obesity worldwide is not exactly caused by simply eating too much food as much it is about eating junk that is correlated to obesity.

Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#119

Post by fucking_tragedy »

mikelyons wrote: post #32
fucking_tragedy wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Growing food has turned into an engineering problem where people think you solve it by investing the least possible resources into it. Our economic system optimizes for exactly this.

What if we had one world religion where everyone's goal in life was to become infinitely loving and utterly selfless? Would we grow food for eachother differently? Would we be compensated differently for doing so?

No, it turns out that the adherents of the religion of "love thy neighbor" and "it's easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God" have no problem with our economic system.

Re: Estimates that mineral levels in vegetables have dropped by up to 90% since 1914

#120

Post by 01100011 »

rm_-rf_slash wrote: post #72
NickM wrote: post #55

Something that has puzzled me recently: how is anyone supposed to get the daily recommended amount of potassium? If you look at foods like bananas that are supposed to be good sources of it, you still need to eat something like eleven bananas a day to get enough (according to US recommended daily intakes, anyway). At least with the minerals mentioned in this posting, you can fall back on supplements if you need to...…

I eat potassium chloride (usually sold as salt substitute for people on low sodium diets) on occasion, like when fasting or working out. It has this awful, stingy metallic taste, but I’ve noticed I tend to have less fatigue and soreness from strength training afterwards. Might be placebo but YMMV.

I have leftover potassium bicarbonate from when I was making wine. I use it as an antacid, mixing it with water. It tastes like absolute shit, a little less so if mixed with some baking soda, and does a pretty good job of helping my heartburn.
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