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Anduril, a startup from Oculus founder Palmer Luckey, now valued at $1B

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251–260 of 375 posts

Re: Anduril, a startup from Oculus founder Palmer Luckey, now valued at $1B

#251
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>So - while I would prefer a "monitored solution" to border control over physical imposing measures, my real preference would be for us to all work toward eliminating these national-level borders completely. You sound like someone with the ability to live anywhere, who consequently has little stake in their current "somewhere." Lots of Americans (and people in other countries) don't have this flexibility. They are di…

> You sound like someone with the ability to live anywhere, who consequently has little stake in their current "somewhere." And you sound like someone with the same privilege speaking from a place of paternalism. Restrictive borders disproportionately harm the poor. > I have family in New England who ran an all-organic dairy farm. They had to shut down a few years ago, in part because they couldn't compete with the f…

Your article leaves out a lot, and you present a false consensus. Here are some counterpoints:

"Illegal immigration to the United States in recent decades has tended to depress both wages and employment rates for low-skilled American citizens, a disproportionate number of whom are black men."

This would seem to contradict your statement that, "Restrictive borders disproportionately harm the poor."

https://www.usccr.gov/pubs/docs/IllegImmig_10-14-10_430pm.pd...

"Both low- and high-skilled natives are affected by the influx of immigrants. But because a disproportionate percentage of immigrants have few skills, it is low-skilled American workers, including many blacks and Hispanics, who have suffered most from this wage dip. The monetary loss is sizable. The typical high school dropout earns about $25,000 annually. According to census data, immigrants admitted in the past two decades lacking a high school diploma have increased the size of the low-skilled workforce by roughly 25 percent. As a result, the earnings of this particularly vulnerable group dropped by between $800 and $1,500 each year."

"But that’s only one side of the story. Somebody’s lower wage is always somebody else’s higher profit. In this case, immigration redistributes wealth from those who compete with immigrants to those who use immigrants—from the employee to the employer. And the additional profits are so large that the economic pie accruing to all natives actually grows. I estimate the current “immigration surplus”—the net increase in the total wealth of the native population—to be about$50 billion annually. But behind that calculation is a much larger shift from one group of Americans to another: The total wealth redistribution from the native losers to the native winners is enormous, roughly a half-trillion dollars a year."

tl;dr Low-skilled citizens are still hurt, and the "bigger economic pie" from illegal immigration turns out to mainly be due to wealth concentration and bad statistics.

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/09/trump-clinto...

>Wait, the migrants and open borders are to blame for xenophobia?

No, lots of people in Germany are worried about mass-migration because... you know, just read my other comment:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20957989

Re: Anduril, a startup from Oculus founder Palmer Luckey, now valued at $1B

#252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The risks of immigration (of any sort) include: - spread of disease - erosion of social trust due to conflicting cultures - erosion of other social capital if immigrant culture has a higher time preference than native culture - identity politics (people vote along ethnic rather than ideological lines) Now, there are certainly benefits to immigration as well, but they must be put in balance. I agree that trade and imm…

Is this like when the British settlers deliberately used smallpox-infected blankets to give diseases to the native Americans? Trying to associate immigration with disease is some vile rhetoric.

>>>Trying to associate immigration with disease is some vile rhetoric.

Cross-border population movements are a potential vector for disease transmission. Just look at the Google Scholar results from some similar searches, especially [1] and [2]. Casting objective physical science concerns as some sort of subjective expression of xenophobia is unhelpful to mitigating or solving real problems.

[1]https://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/iuatld/ijtld/2000/000...

[2]https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2640853/

Re: Anduril, a startup from Oculus founder Palmer Luckey, now valued at $1B

#253
post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your low-effort comment on a throwaway account is detracting from this discussion. I absolutely support harsh punishments for those who employ undocumented laborers illegally (why would I not?). That issue has zero bearing on whether Anduril’s work is “evil.”

All I’m saying is that it’s appalling to see all of these “solutions” almost completely ignore the root problem and instead become obsessed with “border security”. Our borders are secure, immigration is not a threat to your life, the problem is almost purely economic and I think that is the more fruitful discussion I meant no particular offense to you, I see this sentiment regularly in online forums and repeated thro…

>Our borders are secure, immigration is not a threat to your life

Police keep finding bodies [0] of MS-13 victims [1] buried in parks [2] in my area, so pardon me if I disagree.

[0] https://beta.washingtonpost.com/local/public-safety/ms-13-me...

[1] https://patch.com/virginia/greateralexandria/teen-pleads-gui...

[2] https://beta.washingtonpost.com/local/public-safety/fairfax-...

Re: Anduril, a startup from Oculus founder Palmer Luckey, now valued at $1B

#255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe this is too off topic for HN, but I'm genuinely curious what is the best argument for why it is bad/racist to enforce immigration laws? I've heard people argue that a wall won't be effective. But some people seem to have the view that immigration laws shouldn't be enforced at all and we should allow people to use whatever loopholes (refugee status, traveling w/ children) there are to get in and then not show up…

Your question is quite loaded and rests upon false premises - for example, your assertion that people don't show up for court hearings rehashes an anti-immigrant trope that has little basis in fact. Attendance rates are actually quite high, close to 100% for those who have attorneys and still high even for those who don't: https://trac.syr.edu/immigration/reports/562/ It's a deep complex subject that can't be summed…

I think you've been misinformed. The trac study is looking at people who have been here for years who have been going through the system. They show up to court at very high rates.

The "don't show up for court" people were part of a program by the EOIR (which is part of the DOJ) to expedite the cases of newly arrived family units in 10 cities. They very largely did not show up. You can read about it here:

https://www.judiciary.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/Asher%20Testi...

So it seems like there's something very different about these two different groups of asylum seekers.

Anyway no need for the high dudgeon about 'slanderous misinformation.'

Re: Anduril, a startup from Oculus founder Palmer Luckey, now valued at $1B

#256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bit of a tangent, but how is the US/Mexico border a "defense" issue? The Mexican military is not planning an invasion. I am unaware of any Latin American terrorist groups threatening the USA. I am not trying to be pedantic here, but words are important. If the US/Mexico border is a defense issue, then it should be entirely militarized? Andruil would be most accurately described as a surveillance company, would it n…

>>>A bit of a tangent, but how is the US/Mexico border a "defense" issue? Border security is THE most basic, fundamental responsibility of national defense. The US has just spent so frickin' long with benign powers on its land borders, and so focused on global expeditionary operations, that its border security efforts have atrophied. That said, national defense is now an over-arching term that includes a mix of law e…

Then why aren’t they deploying this on the US/Canadian border? Or Alaska? I can see Russia from there.

This whole thing smacks of corruption.

Re: Anduril, a startup from Oculus founder Palmer Luckey, now valued at $1B

#257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eliminating borders is a recipe for disaster. You can't expect your country to remain the same if you let millions or dozens of millions of people freely coming in from different cultures and backgrounds. Immigration is all about "how much is still OK to let in (trade-off between risks and benefits)", and once you say "whoever wants to enter", it's hard to take this kind of opinion seriously.

Nonsense, and you don't believe that either. Otherwise you'd be arguing for hard borders between US states to preserve their unique character. Border politics are drive by racism, pure and simple. You may not be racist, but you should look into the history around the politics of this and the extreme right wingers that back the various anti-immigration front groups.

> Border politics are drive by racism, pure and simple.

How did you come to know the underlying motivations behind millions of people's political beliefs? Are you sure you're not speculating?

Re: Anduril, a startup from Oculus founder Palmer Luckey, now valued at $1B

#259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should not..Nobody will force you.But as a Venezuelan is my duty to mention some reasons to counterbalance your POV: 1- No country is an homogenous group.In the case of Venezuela after Chavez first election the country basically was splitted 50/50 . In Maduro's case the split is easily 90/10 against him.When you refuse to help venezuelans you refuse to help a gigantic group of people who did not choose Maduro at…

> If markets are going to be free an open ,the.movement of.person should be too. Facts. Thanks for coming on here and helping balance the rampant xenophobia in this thread. Please know that some of us in the USA are aware of how our government has treated and continues to treat the Western hemisphere, and that we're doing the best we can to change it. Unfortunately, comments like the one you replied to reflect the ma…

Technically, that is an opinion not a fact. Or can you cite an agreed upon proof I'm not aware of?

Re: Anduril, a startup from Oculus founder Palmer Luckey, now valued at $1B

#260
post #63

Yuck. It's like the perfect marriage of taking any remaining humanity out of law enforcement and add tons of bottomless greed to it. It's so very Peter Thiel-ish. I'd love to say I wish them well, but I hope this company goes out of business due to a public outrage. But they'll always find someone to sell to, like authoritarian governments, and make money hand-over-fist.

Seconded. Of course it would be Palmer Lucky and Peter Thiel who would "pioneer" a company that builds surveillance state technology.

Of course they would.

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