Gombe Chimpanzee War • Hacker News Board

Re: Gombe Chimpanzee War

#41

Post by ASalazarMX » Mon, Sep 09, 2019, 11:07 PM UTC

seunosewa wrote: post #40

ASalazarMX wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unless you have some source, I think the "developing countries especially" affirmation is unfounded. This happens too frequently in all countries, developed or not.

If you are right, that makes my point even stronger, doesn't it? Do you think I am being downvoted for saying we have a lot of ingroup violence or for suggesting there is more ingroup violence in developing countries? These seem to be uncontroversial points. I live in Nigeria. Children get beaten here. From their media, I know it's the same in other African countries, India, etc. Everyone accepts it and we are proud…

Child protection services are a deterrent, yes, but not as strong as one would think. Children usually just endure violence because they think it's normal, or they know child protection services will break their family apart. Abusive parents typically are denounced by other adults, like doctors or teachers.

Still, according to page 172 of this report, it seems you're right, because UNICEF puts more effort at developing countries, although their scope covers much more than just domestic violence: https://www.unicef.org/publications/index_74865.html

Re: Gombe Chimpanzee War

#42

Post by INGELRII » Wed, Sep 11, 2019, 6:50 AM UTC

seunosewa wrote: post #35

INGELRII wrote: post #19

Chimp and humans have similar levels of outgroup violence, but human ingroup violence is much lower. In wild chimpanzee groups violence or threats of violence are daily occurrence Young chimp males start to beat weakest females daily when they grow enough.

In developing countries especially, many parents beat their children daily. Many husbands beat their wives daily. Many teachers beat their students daily. In traffic, motorists and touts engage in fights daily. Governments routinely have their citizens arrested, tortured, and killed. Armed criminals rob, rape and murder people daily. Most babies have their private parts mutilated. All or most of the above would be cl…

Men who beat their wife daily are not majority in any culture.

You can walk into a village or bar full of strangers and you don't automatically get into a fights. You don't have to maintain your position with constant violence.

I doubt there is human culture where average adult gets into violent confrontation for status monthly.

Re: Gombe Chimpanzee War

#43

Post by TheGallopedHigh » Sat, Sep 14, 2019, 7:05 PM UTC

0x8BADF00D wrote: post #11

The question that is unanswered is whether or not the chimpanzees were mimicking human behavior. Or if their violent tendencies are genetic in nature.

This is tangentially addressed in the wiki article:

When Goodall reported on the events of the Gombe War, her account of a naturally occurring war between chimpanzees was not universally believed. At the time, scientific models of human and animal behavior virtually never overlapped.[9] Some scientists accused her of excessive anthropomorphism;[9] others suggested that her presence, and her practice of feeding the chimpanzees, had created violent conflict in a naturally peaceful society.[10] However, later research using less intrusive methods confirmed that chimpanzee societies, in their natural state, wage war.[10][11] A 2018 study published in the American Journal of Physical Anthropology concluded that the Gombe War was most likely a consequence of a power struggle between three high-ranking males, which was exacerbated by an unusual scarcity of fertile females.[12]