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Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

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Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#81

Post by telchar »

VonGuard wrote: post #5

The United States is weird in that you are defined, here, by your job or profession. TV shows put your job title under your name when you appear on them. People's first question is always "What do you do?" at parties and at events. In other countries, this isn't always the case. When I'm in Europe, people ask where you're from, what's for dinner, and what's happening? The question of your job is rarely asked up front…

FWIW, asking someone where they're from can have really negative connotations. It sounds like "you're not one of us" to a lot of people. In the US it's an ideal not to judge someone by where they're from (sadly many do just that), but rather accept that they're here now and that's the important part. So while it can make for good conversation to learn more about a person's background, the topic is often avoided at first to avoid insinuating that the questioner is prejudiced against certain backgrounds. If more people actually held to that ideal, this probably wouldn't be as necessary, but there it is.

Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#82

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

Ididntdothis wrote: post #16
VonGuard wrote: post #5

The United States is weird in that you are defined, here, by your job or profession. TV shows put your job title under your name when you appear on them. People's first question is always "What do you do?" at parties and at events. In other countries, this isn't always the case. When I'm in Europe, people ask where you're from, what's for dinner, and what's happening? The question of your job is rarely asked up front…

" It's how Americans define themselves, which, in the end, generally comes down to how the US doesn't value human life, only the potential earnings thereof." I agree with your observations but this conclusion goes way too far.

I don't think the conclusion is that far off, actually. Ask Americans why they are so afraid of things like single payer and you'll see how quickly they place a dollar value on human life. Most especially the lives of people different from them.

Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#83

Post by lllr_finger »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #68
bluntfang wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Choice is a really funny word when it comes to employees. Most employees don't have a "choice" if you look a little further beyond the surface.

By employees, I’m referring to American customers, who opted for the low prices at Walmart versus their local store. My point is employers didn’t have a choice either, if they wanted to stay in business. This is the end result of arbitrage opportunities due to differences in nations’ wealth.

Walmart isn't really an example of choice.

I've traveled the Midwest and great plains extensively every year since 2009, and have watched it slowly destroy small town life. The locals fought back as much as they could, but saving an extra $50 a week ended up being too alluring, and local businesses died. I've talked to quite a few people that lament how it turned out but are completely resigned to how it happened and that it won't change.

Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#84

Post by golemotron »

glitchc wrote: post #35

I think this reflects a general erosion of trust between employers and employees, which I blame Corporate America for. It used to be a tacit agreement in the workforce that if you worked hard, the boss and the company would take care of you. This illusion has been shattered first by the employers (outsourcing, at-will employment, gig economy), and now the employees (ghosting, switching firms without notice). The lack…

> The lack of trust on both sides engenders the feeling that any promotion is unlikely and every position uncertain, so folks always have one foot out the door

It's not just lack of trust, it's also due to the flattening of organizations necessitated by more collaborative work styles than we had decades ago.

Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#85

Post by povertyworld »

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #62
povertyworld wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I couldn't bring myself to even click on those. The media has cried wolf for so long with Trump, if I see a headline saying "Trump to start WW3", I'm just going to think, boy, the NY Times just keeps hitting new lows and not even click it.

You didn't see that the man literally drew an extra, obviously out of place circle on the official hurricane projection map to make his previous erroneous tweet seem correct? You're missing out. While the error itself is unlikely to start WW3 or tank the stock market, it certainly does cause one to ask questions.

The Trump admin has been doing that stuff from day one with the "alternative facts" thing. I can't keep up with every unpresidential move these guys make. On the plus side, I did just see Trump just fired Bolton which makes war feel a bit less likely.

Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#86

Post by lotsofpulp »

bluntfang wrote: post #76
lotsofpulp wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By employees, I’m referring to American customers, who opted for the low prices at Walmart versus their local store. My point is employers didn’t have a choice either, if they wanted to stay in business. This is the end result of arbitrage opportunities due to differences in nations’ wealth.

Poor people don't choose to not support their communities. They've been put in a position to be forced to "choose" between supporting their local store vs having a warm, safe(ish) place to sleep for their families.

It is a situation that snowballs, but even originally when foreign goods started coming in, people didn't consciously choose to not support their community. They were just doing what consumers do, which is choose to purchase at the best (lowest) price they could find.

But due to information asymmetry and limited ability to analyze and understand the consequences of each and every purchase, there was only one inevitable outcome, assuming goods and services are allowed to be transported between borders.

Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#87

Post by seanmcdirmid »

commandlinefan wrote: post #12
intopieces wrote: post #2

My fear never went away. As someone who graduated at the very beginning of the Great Recession, I have a constant feeling that this cannot be forever.

I graduated in 1995, at the peak of the dot-com boom. I'm still pretty much always in fear of losing my job: there's always somebody willing to do it for less.

I don’t think 1995 was the peak of the dot-com boom. It was just starting out then, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dot-com_bubble

The peak came in 2000, just before the bust (gradual rise, hard fall).

I went to grad school after graduating in 1998, I was lucky enough to miss both recessions (I was in China in 2008). Now I’m jobless during a boom :). But I guess, as always, the best way to protect yourself is to be at the top of the tech curve (this is a double edge sword if you specialize in something that isn’t currently hot).

Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#88

Post by dx87 »

bluntfang wrote: post #63
blhack wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These silly “American bad Europe good” comments always find their way into these discussions, and they are as uninsightful as “if you aren’t the customer you’re the product!”. An equally uncharitable interpretation is: American culture, unlike European, places incredible value on personal agency. We ask each other “what do you do” because we actually have the socially enforced freedom to choose what the answer to the…

>We ask each other “what do you do” because we actually have the socially enforced freedom to choose what the answer to the question is. No we don't, or at least most people don't. People of disenfranchised communities don't choose to not go to college or get a job in software development. This makes up most people.

Saying that if people had a choice they'd go to college or get a job as a software developer is quite an assumption. There's nothing wrong with wanting to go to do something like a trade school. I've got some younger cousins that are earning the same amount as apprentice electricians as my wife with a masters degree.

Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#89

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

munificent wrote: post #39
VonGuard wrote: post #5

The United States is weird in that you are defined, here, by your job or profession. TV shows put your job title under your name when you appear on them. People's first question is always "What do you do?" at parties and at events. In other countries, this isn't always the case. When I'm in Europe, people ask where you're from, what's for dinner, and what's happening? The question of your job is rarely asked up front…

> People's first question is always "What do you do?" at parties and at events. ... When I'm in Europe, people ask where you're from A charitable interpretation is that it's better to ask someone about an aspect of themselves they control over one that was a product of purely random chance. Both tell you many things about the person, but the former gives the person more influence over how they are perceived. I grew u…

> A charitable interpretation is that it's better to ask someone about an aspect of themselves they control over one that was a product of purely random chance.

There is a lot of random chance involved though. Fall out of the right womb and its much easier to land a high status career for some reason.

Re: Americans' fear of losing their jobs grows

#90

Post by spyckie2 »

glitchc wrote: post #35

I think this reflects a general erosion of trust between employers and employees, which I blame Corporate America for. It used to be a tacit agreement in the workforce that if you worked hard, the boss and the company would take care of you. This illusion has been shattered first by the employers (outsourcing, at-will employment, gig economy), and now the employees (ghosting, switching firms without notice). The lack…

Not on the side of Corporate America but curious how you would respond.

As markets get more mature, it becomes difficult for companies to maintain employees if their salary level to contribution rate drops. Is the assumption that employees will absolutely be valuable to a company's strategic goals? How can a company practically care for an employee for life?

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