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Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

latimes.com

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Re: Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

#121

Post by chachachoney »

dirtyid wrote: post #87
notzuck wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why haven't the protesters said this is one of their main issues?

The same reason young, social media savvy altrighters in the west dog-whistle. There's parallels in HK nativism behind these protests similar to your familiar altright talking points. A bunch of mainland immigrants "locusts" to HK to buy up real estate and perverting civilized colonial values. At the end of the day, it's a bunch of ignorant kids stewing over lost economic and social privileges and reminiscing about a…

I'd rather apply occam's razor to the situation. As a result, I believe the student's own articulated reasons for their dissatisfaction.

Also, they're putting their lives and bodies on the line for this, the least we can do is extend them good faith.

If you're going to use the analogy of the west's alt-right movement, you need to explain what and who the eastern equivalent entrenched political and financial interests who would benefit from stoking protest/populism amongst the students. Without those components, you're comparing apples to badgers.

Re: Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

#122

Post by graeme »

dragonsh wrote: post #48
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #17

What can you do about this? Pretty much nothing. China is the second largest economy in the world, and has the second most powerful military. In addition, what they view as the integrity of China is one of their biggest priorities. In addition, they have always viewed British control of Hong Kong as a national humiliation and are bent on erasing all traces of that memory. The way it stands right now, China can inflic…

Well even though my minority position on this issue will downvote my comment I will still write it. As most on this thread are not willing to talk the real culprit behind this protest which is economic inequality and no hope for future development. As I mentioned in my earlier posts, these protests are manifestation of inherent economic inequality in Hong Kong society. The youth in Hong Kong cannot afford a house. Th…

Britain wanted to give HK democracy in the 1960s, but China said they would invade.

Britain democratized and/or gave independence to basically every other colony at that time.

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/world/asia/china-began-pu...

Re: Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

#123

Post by FabHK »

dragonsh wrote: post #48
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #17

What can you do about this? Pretty much nothing. China is the second largest economy in the world, and has the second most powerful military. In addition, what they view as the integrity of China is one of their biggest priorities. In addition, they have always viewed British control of Hong Kong as a national humiliation and are bent on erasing all traces of that memory. The way it stands right now, China can inflic…

Well even though my minority position on this issue will downvote my comment I will still write it. As most on this thread are not willing to talk the real culprit behind this protest which is economic inequality and no hope for future development. As I mentioned in my earlier posts, these protests are manifestation of inherent economic inequality in Hong Kong society. The youth in Hong Kong cannot afford a house. Th…

I'd say the protest is motivated by both, the economic issues (inequality, housing costs), and the political issues (gradual decline of civil liberties, encroaching Chinese influence).

The notion that Britain is to blame for the situation is interesting. Sir John James Cowperthwaite [1] introduced very laissez-faire economic policies in the 1960's (he famously refused to collect economics statistics (such as GDP numbers), as he argued that they'd just encourage technocratic government officials to meddle with the economy).

First, this tells us that libertarian ideas have their limits. They arguably made HK rich back then (but note that many other economies were growing rapidly in the 1960s and 1970s, with far more left-leaning policies; the USA had a marginal tax rate of 70% for the highest earners in those decades and grew just fine).

Second, it is well known that Britain tried to grant Hong Kong more autonomy and democracy way back then, but was thwarted by China in that. Furthermore, the democratic reforms Britain instituted before the handover were promptly revoked by China.

Thirdly, Hong Kong has been a Chinese SAR (special administrative region) for over 20 years by now. To blame Britain for the current conundrum is a bit far-fetched.

Note by the way that several Hong Kong protest leaders have been granted asylum in Germany.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_James_Cowperthwaite

or see the recent book about him:

https://www.amazon.com/Architect-Prosperity-John-Cowperthwai...

Re: Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

#124

Post by chachachoney »

ackbar03 wrote: post #73
Sag0Sag0 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember, this is hacker news. People here love ragging on China, despite the criticism relatively often being hypocritical.

I'm going to support above poster on this one because it's true. Every opinion here that offers an opinion not in support of the protestors seems to be disregarded as a Chinese agent and gets down voted

Yeah, it's crazy to witness solidarity amongst people supporting democratic ideals in the age of the troll farm.

Re: Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

#125

Post by Dirlewanger »

aedron wrote: post #31
mexus wrote: post #18

Why did this story get flagged? I found it interesting and learned a bit more about the topic.

I flagged it. It is political news and has no place on HN. It's a slippery slope to even more stories about politics and current events, that have nothing to do with the site's raison d'être. (BTW I'm just a regular user, not an admin or speaking for any admin)

Hope you're also flagging the tons of other non-technical articles that show up hourly on the front page.

Re: Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

#126

Post by FabHK »

ddeck wrote: post #57
rwmj wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I am quite surprised that the Chinese have allowed the crony capitalism that the Hong Kong Government system is based on to continue unabated. The continually rising levels of inequality that it has generated have been an obvious risk to social stability for a long time, which presumably the CCP are very keen to maintain. The government and press regularly celebrate achieving the title of "Freest economy on earth" (t…

> I am quite surprised that the Chinese have allowed the crony capitalism that the Hong Kong Government system is based on to continue unabated.

Eh? You have a similar crony capitalist system in mainland China, don't you.

And the understanding in HK is that there is sort of tacit "gentlemen's agreement" between Beijing and the HK elites:

Beijing doesn't interfere too much with the rich and powerful in HK and their (continued) ability to rake in money, while those rich and powerful refrain from supporting or advocating for more democracy etc. In other words, both sides are pretty interested in the continuation of the status quo.

Re: Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

#127

Post by [deleted] »

dear wrote: post #69
RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #17

What can you do about this? Pretty much nothing. China is the second largest economy in the world, and has the second most powerful military. In addition, what they view as the integrity of China is one of their biggest priorities. In addition, they have always viewed British control of Hong Kong as a national humiliation and are bent on erasing all traces of that memory. The way it stands right now, China can inflic…

>What can you do about this? The congress is doing something potentially quite powerful: https://www.congress.gov/bill/116th-congress/house-bill/3289

[deleted]

Re: Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

#129

Post by xster »

notzuck wrote: post #62
dragonsh wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well even though my minority position on this issue will downvote my comment I will still write it. As most on this thread are not willing to talk the real culprit behind this protest which is economic inequality and no hope for future development. As I mentioned in my earlier posts, these protests are manifestation of inherent economic inequality in Hong Kong society. The youth in Hong Kong cannot afford a house. Th…

So why haven't the protesters said this is one of their main issues?

Same reason why the rich-controlled media manage to get the 99% in the US to be too busy calling each other bigots and nazis instead of fighting for their common economic cause.

Re: Eyewitnesses describe brutal beatings by HK police

#130

Post by dragonsh »

graeme wrote: post #122
dragonsh wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well even though my minority position on this issue will downvote my comment I will still write it. As most on this thread are not willing to talk the real culprit behind this protest which is economic inequality and no hope for future development. As I mentioned in my earlier posts, these protests are manifestation of inherent economic inequality in Hong Kong society. The youth in Hong Kong cannot afford a house. Th…

Britain wanted to give HK democracy in the 1960s, but China said they would invade. Britain democratized and/or gave independence to basically every other colony at that time. https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/28/world/asia/china-began-pu...

I already commented on this issue on another post so won't repeat again.

Britain never had intention to give democracy to Hong Kong which will require it to make economic contributions to a colony. Their first priority has always been to safeguard their own economic interests. [1]

[1] https://www.scmp.com/comment/insight-opinion/article/1419999...

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