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How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

nytimes.com

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Re: How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

#31

Post by coldtea »

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #27
fermenflo wrote: post #20

Ok? I feel like Apple is free to promote whatever they damn please on their own platform. Are we seriously criticizing a company for promoting their products ahead of 3rd party products on their own platform? and I mean, how much money do you think Apple is making from someone having their compass app downloaded? Seems like an inflammatory and in-genuine story.

Ah, the old, "It's my football so I should always get to be quarterback" argument. I guess that works for a while.

It should work forever, as long you own the field, and people want to use said field because that gives them access to a huge marketplace of devices that you've built and sold.

So there's that...

Re: How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

#32

Post by simion314 »

BuckRogers wrote: post #13

It’s a privately held platform. The apps created by Apple should be on top if they want them to be. There’s no right to equal access such as with Net Neutrality, it’s not a publicly owned or subsidized platform. The only way this could possibly be wrong is if we nationalize Apple. I’m definitely left of center economically and I have no problem with Apple placing their apps on top. It would completely align with curr…

>At 40% market share in the US, they’re not even a monopoly

Can someone confirm my understanding that there is no percentage like 90% and if you are over that you are a monopoly . Is more about if you abuse your dominant position to screw the competition and consumers, and in this case Apple is screwing the application developers that they compete with by abusing their dominant position.

Re: How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

#33

Post by Wowfunhappy »

bluntfang wrote: post #26
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #14

I'm not saying this isn't a problem, but it seems pretty minor compared to the fact that: 1) Apple's apps come preinstalled on every iPhone. 2) Apple's apps have permission to do things that 3rd party apps cannot. If I search for "Web Browser" on the App Store... well, technically I'll get results from third parties, but every single one is just a UI skin around Apple's own browser. That strikes me as a much larger p…

>Apple's apps come preinstalled on every iPhone. Not only that, but the autocreated links to addresses in the messaging app will not work with other map apps. In fact, if you've uninstalled the apple maps app, the address links in messenger are completely useless. * unless i'm mistaken, but I'm a fairly adept technical user and haven't found a way to make address links work.

You're not mistaken. I'd classify that under "3rd party apps have permission to do things other apps cannot." Yet another example would be how Apple Pay comes up automatically near payment terminals. Or how most of the default actions in the Share Sheet—all of which are for Apple Apps—cannot be turned off.

Re: How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

#34

Post by ceejayoz »

Causality1 wrote: post #25
fermenflo wrote: post #20

Ok? I feel like Apple is free to promote whatever they damn please on their own platform. Are we seriously criticizing a company for promoting their products ahead of 3rd party products on their own platform? and I mean, how much money do you think Apple is making from someone having their compass app downloaded? Seems like an inflammatory and in-genuine story.

The EU fined Microsoft six hundred million dollars just for including Internet Explorer and Windows Media Player in Windows by default. Apple's behavior is much worse than that.

Apple does not have a monopoly in the mobile phone market like Microsoft had in the operating system market.

Microsoft also had a court order to comply with that they forgot about in Windows 7. https://www.engadget.com/2013/03/06/microsoft-european-commi...

Re: How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

#35

Post by jakear »

Causality1 wrote: post #25
fermenflo wrote: post #20

Ok? I feel like Apple is free to promote whatever they damn please on their own platform. Are we seriously criticizing a company for promoting their products ahead of 3rd party products on their own platform? and I mean, how much money do you think Apple is making from someone having their compass app downloaded? Seems like an inflammatory and in-genuine story.

The EU fined Microsoft six hundred million dollars just for including Internet Explorer and Windows Media Player in Windows by default. Apple's behavior is much worse than that.

IMO, that fine is (for lack of a better term) bullshit. Does Android present a browser selection to EU customers?

Re: How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

#36

Post by tracer4201 »

Merits (and anti trust possibilities) of Apple doing this aside, just a shout out that it’s another anti tech article on the NYT. They have a daily piece against one of the FAANGs. It’s at the point where I could start plotting this data over time and plastering it in its own thread.

Just remember folks - NYT directly competes with many of the FAANGs. Its awfully convenient to do reporting questioning your directly rivals, especially when you never preface your articles mentioning the conflict of interest.

Re: How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

#37

Post by Bud »

HelloMcFly wrote: post #6
OJFord wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ranking by count the all apps installed by users who have previously searched for might do it. Not saying that's a good algorithm, but one _might_ be tempted to think that with enough users it should be fine. The 'bug' being that all Apple's users are Apple users, so Apple apps would get pushed high for any search. I'm certainly not suggesting that's what happeened (or even that it would be something so simplistic),…

Agreed, but the end result is that their algorithm pre-fix was clearly faulty and should be considered a mistake. Their gymnastics to the contrary just come across as either a bad-faith argument or self-delusion.

What comes across as cherry-picking to me is pointing out a single random inconsequential web search and the result it used to have in a previous year.

Re: How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

#38

Post by ceejayoz »

simion314 wrote: post #32
BuckRogers wrote: post #13

It’s a privately held platform. The apps created by Apple should be on top if they want them to be. There’s no right to equal access such as with Net Neutrality, it’s not a publicly owned or subsidized platform. The only way this could possibly be wrong is if we nationalize Apple. I’m definitely left of center economically and I have no problem with Apple placing their apps on top. It would completely align with curr…

>At 40% market share in the US, they’re not even a monopoly Can someone confirm my understanding that there is no percentage like 90% and if you are over that you are a monopoly . Is more about if you abuse your dominant position to screw the competition and consumers, and in this case Apple is screwing the application developers that they compete with by abusing their dominant position.

You have to have a dominant position to abuse it.

You can quibble over whether 80% or 90% is a monopoly, but 40% clearly isn't one.

Re: How Apple's Apps Topped Rivals in the App Store It Controls

#40

Post by jakelazaroff »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #4

I appreciate Apple offering its own apps, as I don't trust anyone else with my data.

Apple is definitely better than most, but don't hand them a blank check. They recently stopped a Siri "grading" program after it was discovered that they were sending voice recordings to employees of a third-party contractor without users' consent: https://www.theverge.com/2019/8/2/20751270/apple-stops-contr...
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