Earlier quoted context omitted.
An entire system that incentivizes and absolves this behavior at all levels. I’m serious. This is what power and wealth do: they allow you to break the rules that the rest of us plebs have to abide by.
"I don't even wait. And when you're a star, they let you do it. You can do anything. Grab them by the pussy. You can do anything." -- future President of the United States, Donald Trump.
Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
461–470 of 770 posts
Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
#462Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hi. According to MIT Epstein donated ~800k over 20 years, looking into a sudden large donor makes sense, but AFAIK there wouldn't have been anything to find 20 years ago. Certainly possible, but it would be interesting to understand the timeline and reasons. The "keep this donation anonymous" would take on an entirely different meaning if it was prior to the prohibition, for example.
Except they hid millions as an anonymous donor per the nymag article. That’s whats so damaging.
Accepting millions from him in 2002 would be unremarkable.
Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
#463Earlier quoted context omitted.
Who said anyone’s life lacked value? There’s nothing wrong with being a market clerk, or a restaurant server, or a farm laborer, or a fashion model, or an administrative assistant, or a factory worker, or a janitor, or a soldier, or a mail carrier, or a taxi driver, or a stay-at-home parent, .... The problem is that many people in many places are stuck with a choice of either working themselves to death at a job they…
There are porn stars who live comfortably yet remain in the business. There are even wives who like to be pimped out by their husbands because it's kinky to them; that's technically still prostitution. I don't think the 'happy hooker' is just a theoretical thing. I think it exists, and it happens all the time. The fact that there is prostitution doesn't imply there is a power imbalance. Maybe if prostitution wasn't s…
Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
#464Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don’t know what we’re arguing. If you want to professionally associate with people who have raped and exploited kids from a position of extreme wealth and privilege, then I guess you’re probably legally allowed to, as long as you’re not putting people in danger. You have to decide where you’re at on that. I know where I’m at. I think most people do. Which is why they’re disgusted.
The question isn't about legality. It's about morality. Is it morally wrong to judge people who decide to associate with criminals after they have served their sentence? That to me is the crux of the issue here. What it sounds like is that criminals are not absolved by serving their sentence. Or maybe some are but it depends on the crime? And sometimes it's okay to ostracize those that believe that criminals are abso…
No. Judge away.
> What it sounds like is that criminals are not absolved by serving their sentence. Or maybe some are but it depends on the crime? And sometimes it's okay to ostracize those that believe that criminals are absolved by serving their sentence, depending on the crime?
Correct.
Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
#465Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Why are there inevitably people who want to do the mental gymnastics of assuming innocence for a man convicted of sex trafficking? This is extremely good question that I continue to be unable to find an answer. Much bigger case than Epstein would be that of Donald Trump. Everyone knew he is a six-time bankruptee, posted record $1B (billion) dollar loss with IRS and haven't made any of his many business ventures suc…
> Yet the consensus of 2016 was that he is the only man capable of steering forward a budget of the most valuable country on the face of planet Earth. To be fair, more people who voted didn't think he was the best choice of a person "capable of ..." than thought he was. He only won thanks to a) a quirk of the American electoral system and b) his opponent also being historically unpopular, by nature of having been in…
What quirk is that? It has a lot of quirks, and I think you mean one in particular but not sure which one.
Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
#466the HN comments on all the recent Epstein stories have been very strange. I have to assume at least some of the more contrarian views are coming from people who haven't been following the full story in the US news, and so don't quite grasp the nature of the allegations. The case is far from just "some rich guy turned out to be an abuser". If you can't understand why the reaction is so strong against those who maintai…
I think it is simple to understand common understanding of criminal justice when no one asks where was Michael Jackson’s servants when he decided to spend private time with terminally ill children.
Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
#467Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think people who accept high-profile positions don't have a moral right to retain those positions. It may not always be the case that they have a moral obligation to abandon them at the first sign of trouble; the analysis will always be fact-specific. Here, I don't think there's much doubt. Ito should have left weeks ago. He had to know this was going to happen; the last few weeks of drama have come entirely at the…
> I think people who accept high-profile positions don't have a moral right to retain those positions. I'm not really sure what this even means. Everyone has some moral right to the position they're in. The question is how much. > He had to know this was going to happen; the last few weeks of drama have come entirely at the Lab's expense, seemingly as a long-shot gamble that Ito might weather the storm. This is sort…
* Ito's position at MIT was so compromised that, for the good of the organization, he needed to quit. He had an obligation to do so; MIT didn't owe him his role, but rather he had joined to serve MIT. He was doing so no longer.
* One reason he was so compromised, in my estimation of the available information, is that he repeatedly did something egregiously wrong. Once again: I've never even heard of a boss anywhere else in technology putting their employees in a position where they felt they may have had to intervene --- at the workplace --- to thwart sex trafficking by an invited VIP guest.
The former argument I think is clear and defensible even if you harbor doubts about how bad Ito's actions were.
Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
#468Internal email this afternoon from President Reif: To the members of the MIT community, Last night, The New Yorker published an article that contains deeply disturbing allegations about the engagement between individuals at the Media Lab and Jeffrey Epstein. Because the accusations in the story are extremely serious, they demand an immediate, thorough and independent investigation. This morning, I asked MIT’s General…
If Xeni Jardin's claim below is true, Joi Ito needs to resign from more than just MIT: "I told the @nytimes everything. So did whistleblowers I was in touch with inside @MIT and @Edge. They printed none of the most damning truths. @joi is on the board of the NYT. THANK GOD FOR @RonanFarrow" EDIT: NYTimes is now indicating that Ito has resigned from NYT Co board, effective immediately [2]. [1] https://twitter.com/xeni…
Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
#469Earlier quoted context omitted.
If Xeni Jardin's claim below is true, Joi Ito needs to resign from more than just MIT: "I told the @nytimes everything. So did whistleblowers I was in touch with inside @MIT and @Edge. They printed none of the most damning truths. @joi is on the board of the NYT. THANK GOD FOR @RonanFarrow" EDIT: NYTimes is now indicating that Ito has resigned from NYT Co board, effective immediately [2]. [1] https://twitter.com/xeni…
Nice omission from the NYT always printing half truths as usual until they cannot get away with it anymore.
Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties
#470Earlier quoted context omitted.
When the subject of discussion is a man known to be involved in human trafficking, being so trusting and naive does not a lick of good. You seem to be repeatedly ignoring the context of Epstein's criminal conviction.
No, this wasn't about Epstein, but about the general claim of rich old men having power over women.
Inadvertently I’m sure, your and some other people’s posts here come across as normalising the outward behaviour of Epstein and people like him. But the behaviour of Epstein in particular is not normalisable. The women concerned about the status of the girls Epstein took with him weren’t faced with ‘a rich guy with some young girls’. They were faced with this rich guy with these young girls, face to face, with all the emotional context of actual direct human interaction.
I can image he a situation in which I meet an older guy with some young girls and it’s all fine. I can also imagine ones where I would be deeply uncomfortable and queasy about the interpersonal dynamics going on.
The women at the lab weren’t in a hypothetical situation, they were in a specific real life situation, and the way it made them feel was clearly very, very uncomfortable to the point of deep distress.
So I can see why you think talking about hypotheticals is all fine and you don’t understand why it upsets people. But a lot of wealthy powerful people have spent a lot of effort trying to normalise, justify, write off and cover for Epstein’s behaviour. Those efforts created a context where Epstein was able, again, to traffic and sexually abuse children. So any direction of the discussion towards a context that even inadvertently appears to be normalising any aspect of his behaviour, well, I’d say this thread at this time on this topic isn’t the time or place.