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Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

nytimes.com

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Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#261

Post by davrosthedalek »

coldtea wrote: post #211
googlryas wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the critical thinking "Epstein did bad things. Therefore, everything Epstein did was bad"? Critical thinking can tell you there is a higher chance the women were sex trafficked considering the employer and his immoral proclivities. It can't tell you if they actually were or not.

No, the critical thinking mentioned, is: 1) If a powerful man who has been accused of sex trafficking 2) shows up with two girls less than half his age, 3) who are from eastern europe (while he is an American, not exactly where he'd get girlfriends or assistants), 4) he passes them of like his "assistants", 5) while they look like models, 6) and they make everybody uncomfortable to the point of telling them to signal…

So you say "no", but then explain how critical thinking leads to "then critical thinking says he's more probably than not indeed sex trafficking". How is that different from the statement "Critical thinking can tell you there is a higher chance the women were sex trafficked considering the employer and his immoral proclivities" except putting that higher chance at >50%?

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#262

Post by hackinthebochs »

point78 wrote: post #258
nf8nnfufuu wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I don't get it. Somebody having assistants who look like models and are from Eastern Europe is suspicious of trafficking women? How? Why? I have heard about Epstein, obviously with hindsight all sorts of things he did can be seen in a new light. I just don't understand what is so damning about the passage above. Would somebody who is trafficking women really take them everywhere he goes? I thought it would be…

A 60 year old American financier who's uglier than a frog has 2 teenage eastern european models as "assistants"....does that add up to you?

It adds up when you add the fact that he was a billionaire, or at least in the vicinity.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#263

Post by moron4hire »

solidsnack9000 wrote: post #191
moron4hire wrote: post #59

My mother works in the non-profit fundraising sector, originally centered on education, but now runs her own consultancy for non-profits of all sizes. She knows pretty much all the rules and laws about donations and propriety within fundraising foundations. I've helped her with her business, both in actual operations and for her IT concerns. I've also worked in other regulated industries, so I have a fair amount of f…

What are some examples of things where you can get fined or put in jail for what lay-people might consider an honest mistake?

A simple one that comes up a lot is back dating when a donation "occurred" to be within a certain tax year. Donations don't "occur" until they are processed completely. The end of the tax year has lots of donations come in. If the foundation isn't on their toes, they might not process all of them in time for the tax deadline. It's illegal (though completely possible, and happens all the time) to back-date the donation date to before the end of the tax year, after the tax year has ended.

Others come up as errors of classification. A certain donor might donate a certain good or service instead of straight money. That donation has to be recorded at fair market value and has to be treated as if it were a proper vendor relationship. Determining that value can be quite complex, especially considering such donations are usually done out of excess stock or time that the donor doesn't have a good valuation on out of their own books.

And often, those sorts of donations come with an expectation of quid pro quo: I give two dozen bails of hay that I have just lying around and expect to get a ticket to the next fundraising ball (which might have a few-thousand dollar list price). If the foundation gives that ticket, the bails of hay are no longer a donation and listing it as such is tax fraud.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#264

Post by asveikau »

asveikau wrote: post #22
CrazyStat wrote: post #4

This seemed inevitable after the New Yorker article yesterday detailing how Ito and his team hid Epstein's involvement from the university, which had disqualified Epstein as a donor. Taking money from a dirty source is one thing; hiding it from the university because they've blacklisted that person in particular is about as unforgivable a crime as you'll find in academia

I remember similar stories about people who took money from Harvey Weinstein, for example there was an AIDS nonprofit he gave millions to. It all highlights the difficult job facing people tasked with taking money from donors in this way. They won't always have 20/20 hindsight. They may learn about sketchiness after they already took the money. They may be so blinded by what they see as generosity and good will that…

Anyone care to explain the down votes? I am not defending anyone implicated, or claiming knowledge of specifics, but saying that vetting donors in a world where the category of "criminal-philanthropist" is a thing probably gets difficult.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#265

Post by moron4hire »

davrosthedalek wrote: post #228
esoterica wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jail for what? Accepting donations from a pedo is not a crime.

He hid the donations from MIT. Since Epstein was on the blacklist, MIT might have a civil case against him. I'm not a lawyer, so I don't know if that would be, for example, "fraud".

Also, using your professional relationship as a foundation employee to solicit funds for your personal, private ventures is suuuuuper illegal.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#266

Post by hackinthebochs »

liability wrote: post #255
nf8nnfufuu wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've read about the first half, which didn't mention that Epstein was already convicted for sex trafficking by the time he arrived at MIT in that story. It didn't occur to me that he would be walking around freely doing deals if he had already been convicted. I didn't have the information that he was let off the hook and there was also no indication I should google for something like that. What search term should I h…

You read the first half of what exactly? From the subtitle of the article you responded to: > New documents show that the M.I.T. Media Lab was aware of Epstein’s status as a convicted sex offender, and that Epstein directed contributions to the lab far exceeding the amounts M.I.T. has publicly admitted. What did you think "Epstein’s status as a convicted sex offender" meant? Are you earnestly confused, or are you try…

Sex offender and sex trafficker are in entirely different ballparks.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#267

Post by tP5n »

nf8nnfufuu wrote: post #238
liability wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well in assuming good faith I assume he read the article, which should have cleared up any such misunderstandings...

I've read about the first half, which didn't mention that Epstein was already convicted for sex trafficking by the time he arrived at MIT in that story. It didn't occur to me that he would be walking around freely doing deals if he had already been convicted. I didn't have the information that he was let off the hook and there was also no indication I should google for something like that. What search term should I h…

literally, 'epstein' would have been enough

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#268

Post by rayiner »

ryanlol wrote: post #257
rayiner wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m pretty sure most bars require you to be 21 (maybe 18 in Europe)?

And why would that exclude girls? Would “girls’ night out” be an unusual expression where you’re from?

So is “boys night out” but you wouldn’t refer to grown men as boys.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#269

Post by graeme »

nf8nnfufuu wrote: post #15
jakelazaroff wrote: post #3

Good. Here’s a particularly damning passage from Ronan Farrow’s New Yorker article [1]: > According to Swenson, Ito had informed Cohen that Epstein “never goes into any room without his two female ‘assistants,’ ” whom he wanted to bring to the meeting at the Media Lab. Swenson objected to this, too, and it was decided that the assistants would be allowed to accompany Epstein but would wait outside the meeting room. >…

Sorry, I don't get it. Somebody having assistants who look like models and are from Eastern Europe is suspicious of trafficking women? How? Why? I have heard about Epstein, obviously with hindsight all sorts of things he did can be seen in a new light. I just don't understand what is so damning about the passage above. Would somebody who is trafficking women really take them everywhere he goes? I thought it would be…

You have to consider that paragraph in the context that Epstein's activities were widely and publicly known at that point.

As far as secrecy, Epstein apparently wasn't very secret at all. Many reports from Virgin Islands where he had a home.

Re: Joi Ito Resigns from M.I.T. Media Lab After Outcry over Jeffrey Epstein Ties

#270

Post by liability »

totalZero wrote: post #246
lifeisstillgood wrote: post #186

More and more problems seem to be linked to provenance of money. Money Laundering of dirty cash is one major obvious example (see impact on everything from London house prices to international banking) and yet just being able to trace / label money coming out of Epstein and into MIT lab would have raised this issue a decade ago Imagine somehow being able to tag bitcoin address / transactions with "this money came fro…

That's such a bizarre concept. Morality isn't something that can be inherited by accepting research contributions, in my book. Why taint the money, when it can help us learn, build, heal, and grow? Epstein, not the money he donated, is responsible for bad things he did. As an alum, I'm not surprised at the Institute's cowardice, but I'd like to see MIT stand up for someone, ANYONE in its community when under fire pub…

> Why taint the money, when it can help us learn, build, heal, and grow?

Because when that much money is involved, there are strings attached. In this particular case, Epstein got to visit the lab and had people like Ito covering for him, pretending the situation was normal and on the level.

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