The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites • Hacker News Board

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#71

Post by bradly » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:37 PM UTC

rowanG077 wrote: post #55

bradly wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many people believe the charitable givings were what gave Epstein his credibility, allowing him to continue what he was doing. Accepting the donations was enabling Epstein.

Is there actual proof of the government knowing about Epsteins actions and looking the other way because of his donations? I find that really hard to believe...

I do not know about the U.S. government, but at M.I.T. he had been already been banned from charitable giving, so Joichi was having to lie about the source of the money.

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#72

Post by loeg » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:37 PM UTC

bb88 wrote: post #54

darawk wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does that actually launder anyone's reputation? Epstein was doing this sort of stuff before he was ever arrested. He seems to have been legitimately interested in funding science research. Unfortunately the world is actually complicated and people aren't simply one-dimensional villains. The guy did some genuinely good things, in a seemingly honest way. That doesn't in any way absolve him of the horrible things he did…

Yes. It does. Money changes minds. And if you believe it does not, I have $100,000 that says it will.

Where can I cash in on this $100,000?

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#73

Post by TheOtherHobbes » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:37 PM UTC

darawk wrote: post #41

BurningFrog wrote: post #24

"This single event shows how corrupt this class of people I already disliked is!" is the definition of how prejudice works.

It's clear at this point that traditional journalists are opposed to tech because of what it's done to their profession. I don't blame them for being upset, but the way it's manifesting here is not good for anyone.

It's not clear at all. In fact it's not just not clear, it's not even remotely true.

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#74

Post by nitwit005 » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:39 PM UTC

Just seems to be using this event to rant about stuff they were already upset about. The first name mentioned is Marc Zuckerburg, who has nothing to do with the actual scandal.

This is hardly the first charity scandal related to accepting donations from questionable donors. The issue predates electricity, let alone modern tech companies.

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#75

Post by peteforde » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:42 PM UTC

This is, in my opinion, a stunningly poor reaction to the Epstein/Media Lab trash fire. You can believe, as I do, that Epstein was a monster and Joi fucked up in the worst possible way and also retain enough independent thought to see this article for what it is: an opportunistic rant by an angry person who imagines themselves the lone voice of reason against a vast conspiracy that includes everyone from wealthy Greek aristocrats (lol) to Bill Gates to Timothy Leary.

Please.

There's a lot to be frustrated by in the culture and cult of tech, but the irony of Morozov posting this op-ed on a site that is usually proudly powered by a mountain of open source created by the sorts of smart kids that spend time researching at the MIT Media Lab is galling.

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#76

Post by navs » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:45 PM UTC

This is an angry piece.

The Epstein case doesn't surprise me. Most people with money are morally reprehensible or have dealt with morally reprehensible people.

What I can't understand is where TED talks play into this? Are they evil by proxy?

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#77

Post by loeg » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:47 PM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #63

davrosthedalek wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, but these contributions were anonymous. So the reach of the sleazeball to boy scout effect was limited to the people Epstein talked to anyway, and could see the sleazeballness first hand.

They were anonymous because the recipients hid the fact of their origin . There are receipts of their conversations about this.

Your comment is problematic for Ito, but non-responsive to the parent comment's argument.

The thread is: bb88 proposes that Epstein's charitable giving to MIT was a way to reputation launder ("turn a sleazeball into a boyscout").

davrosthedalek disputed that claim, as the donations were anonymous.

The reason for anonymity doesn't matter; the net effect is there is no plausible reputation laundering effect from anonymous donations.

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#78

Post by rowanG077 » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:47 PM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #66

rowanG077 wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't answer the question. You really think a person that knows Epstein has done the things he has done and knows about the "The Jeffrey Epstein Research Lab at MIT" is going to think that Epstein is some A OK dude?

How do you think he got away with what he did for so long? People would hear 'that Epstein fellow is said to be pedophile' and think 'Jeffrey Epstein, respectable philanthropist? Surely not.' Why are you caping so hard for this guy?

What do you mean getting away with what he did for so long? He was sentenced more then 10 years ago for having sex with underage girls.

Donating money doesn't make you a philanthropist. I'm not caping(? not sure what this means) at all for Epstein. I simply think it beyond ridiculous to fault an institution for taking donations from any individual as if that act implies the institution agrees with all actions that individual has taken.

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#79

Post by marcinzm » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:47 PM UTC

tomjakubowski wrote: post #65

marcinzm wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is the line? If you stole something at 16 does that mean you're to be shunned from society forever? Is the line rape? Is it murder? Sexual assault? Being a nazi? Being a conservative? Being a liberal? Associating with someone in the shunned group? And what aren't we allowed to do with these people? Accept their money? Talk to them? Have dinner with them? Be in the same room as them? Same building? Be friends wi…

You can begin to talk about rehabilitating abhorrent people only after they've demonstrated some contrition for their actions and growth towards being better. By all accounts, Epstein showed none of that.

The comment I responded to did not mention Epstein in any way or form.

Re: The Epstein scandal at MIT shows the moral bankruptcy of techno elites

#80

Post by adamnemecek » Sat, Sep 07, 2019, 10:49 PM UTC

loeg wrote: post #69

adamnemecek wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rethink your stance.

Unsubstantiated imperative sentences with no further context are not especially compelling arguments and do not meet the usual merit bar for comments on this site.

Why do you talk like this "the usual merit bar for comments on this site"?