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Goodreads Is Broken

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21–30 of 292 posts

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#21
post #6

I read quite a bit and generally like Goodreads for what it is, but I agree that it's essentially not grown at all in 12 years. There are parts that are broken, there are features that are lacking, and it frustrates me to no end. Many, many times I've thought of how I'd build a competitor, but it is pointless because Goodread's moat is too big: the integrations with the kindle go a very long way towards cultivating e…

> the integrations with the kindle go a very long way towards cultivating engagement (when you start a book, kindle will update your profile by default, it'll add your rating, mark the book as finished, all through the normal ux of the kindle

Not in Germany though

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#22

That first graphic with failed title search results reminded me of a project I did working on a library catalog search using Solr. We tuned the relevancy ranking to work for exactly those sorts of searches, and put the things the OP was looking for on top (or at least under other books with exact same title). His examples look just like some of our QA searches for our relevancy ranking (in addition to standard tf/idf…

I build search engines for a living. While I appreciate the hacker spirit of your project with Solr, I also see this as a huge problem that leads to bad search experiences. Tuning boosts in Solr is not even close to a reasonable way to solve problems like this. Arguably not even for an underfunded library, but certainly not for a high web traffic consumer website.

For one, you need disciplined acceptance criteria in the form of both qualitative standards (things a non-technical manager can look at and say yes or no) as well as various relevancy measurements like mean reciprocal rank and normalized discounted cumulative gain (via acquiring human annotated data if needed).

When people only focus on qualitative feedback on top of boosts and hacks in an off the shelf tool, they usually end up with some weird witches’ brew of bizarre boosts and time-decay weighting that is extremely fragile and can’t be robustly changed or even understood without the qualitative performance going haywire. You need disciplined study of quantitative ranking metrics to know the drivers of performance, fall off as you move down the ranking position, and to make search index updates reproducible and make incremental improvement measurable.

Meanwhile if you only focus on quantitative metrics, you might miss obvious red flags. The relevance score used for NDCG might be biased some way. You might surface highly relevant results to only one context or sense of the words in a query (like only showing fruit for “apple” and never tech gadgets). You need people who make the subjective appraisal of quality for users to be looped in.

Here’s the point. When this is all missing, you will lose credibility with people making the decisions. They’ll hear some engineer babble about NDCG but then say the darn thing doesn’t work in the QA testing. Or they’ll say the qualitative results look OK and get angry when weird counter-examples pop up in the second or third results pages, which might have been measured with quantitative metrics.

When this happens, executives and managers just want to punt. They want the “nobody ever got fired for buying IBM” equivalent for search, and that’s how you end up with Confluence still only supporting exact title matching and having no ability for actual content relevancy search.

In this sense, the little projects showing “look what us non-specialists could cook up by hacking some boosts in Solr!” do a lot of harm and should not be considered as the plucky success stories they are often painted to be.

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#23
What sites aren't badly broken? I just spent 30 minutes wrestling with Booking.com. I have many issues with Amazon, and Google keep changing their services under my feet.

Not to mention all the ways they want to shape the experience that I don't want, with their useless and biased suggestions being one that sticks out for me, as well as their user communities that I'm pretty sure exist to denigrate individual perspectives, since they aren't designed to let people organize and be critical, just a noisy crowd with grossly aggregated ratings.

But these big companies don't care. They dominate in their areas. Their best, only reasonable option is to drag their feet on consumer oriented features as much as possible, to save money and spread out behind the scenes. If a competitor comes along with a unique feature, they can just add it and destroy them. It's impossible for the consumer and innovation.

As we go to very high levels of integration, where our activities, connections and other personal data are involved in every decision, the only solution is to separate data and services, so I can access the data I want, process it in my own system that for any activity can be more comprehensive than they can reasonably provide — unless they all, either via backend "cooperation" or duplication have an incredibly privacy invading profile of me — and finally process it with their service. This is what Solid proposes. It's a long-term, multi perspective, standards based project, and I don't know any reasonable alternative.

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#24
post #20

I don't know about the quality of Goodreads but I don't see a big problem with her two search examples. In the first one she searches for "the confession" and another "the confession" title is shown, together with other way more popular titles with "confession" in their titles. I'm guessing most people want fuzzy google-like searches but sure, exact matches of more obscure books can be given more relevance or search…

The problem with Goodreads’ search is definitely that it mostly only works with full titles. It’s aggravating to have to type in the full title of a popular book for it to have to be the top result; it seems like a really basic search implementation.

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#25
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree whole-heartedly. Used to be ok as an aggregator, but now with their repeated force attempts to make you sign in, I just avoid it.

its not even that - the content on medium is largely spam

I haven't actually browsed medium in a while, so I didn't know how bad it was.

I do know that most stories I am linked to on there are barely a single paragraph of meat

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#26

What sites aren't badly broken? I just spent 30 minutes wrestling with Booking.com. I have many issues with Amazon, and Google keep changing their services under my feet. Not to mention all the ways they want to shape the experience that I don't want, with their useless and biased suggestions being one that sticks out for me, as well as their user communities that I'm pretty sure exist to denigrate individual perspec…

    they can just add it 
    and destroy them
Or buy them out and sunset them

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#27

What sites aren't badly broken? I just spent 30 minutes wrestling with Booking.com. I have many issues with Amazon, and Google keep changing their services under my feet. Not to mention all the ways they want to shape the experience that I don't want, with their useless and biased suggestions being one that sticks out for me, as well as their user communities that I'm pretty sure exist to denigrate individual perspec…

Booking.com is exponentially better than Airbnb though.

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#28
post #17

It astounds me that after 20+ years of Amazon, nobody's come close to creating a good way to discover books. Amazon.com is particularly bad at it, but browsing the shelves of a library is still a better experience than what I can get from Goodreads.

Could it be that there is a moneyed interest in keeping things undiscovered?

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#29
post #19

The entire reading ecosystem at Amazon is stagnant. The kindle e-readers have had release after release of subpar hardware with features introduced by now-killed competitors a decade ago. Read reviews of the brand new Oasis, a $300 product featuring a micro USB port. Amazon does not care about readers, probably because they drive so few dollars and the market is won. Reading does not drive prime subscriptions, and an…

> The entire reading ecosystem at Amazon is stagnant

They are actively malignant at this point. They are breaking embargoes now[1], and clearly won't be satisfied until they kill traditional publishing.

I dropped Prime last year, and it was substantially easier than I thought it would be.

Since then, they've just kept doing disgusting, grotesque crap[2]. At this point, I won't buy anything from them. The whole site reminds me of that cleaning-product smell at Walmart - any time I'm exposed to it, I just want to leave.

That orangey-yellow color means a fight with an untrustworthy, grubby greedhead robot that consistently fucks up delivery and makes me deal with them some more. Who needs that?

[1] https://boingboing.net/2019/09/05/amazon-breaks-embargo-on-m...

[2] https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20190807/20024842742/ring-...

Re: Goodreads Is Broken

#30
post #6

I read quite a bit and generally like Goodreads for what it is, but I agree that it's essentially not grown at all in 12 years. There are parts that are broken, there are features that are lacking, and it frustrates me to no end. Many, many times I've thought of how I'd build a competitor, but it is pointless because Goodread's moat is too big: the integrations with the kindle go a very long way towards cultivating e…

I don't think its all that bad. My only gripe with Goodreads is the lack of a proper tagging system, something like NovelUpdates `Release Filtering` which uses tags and genres in addition to categories. My point is Goodreads is certainly good for getting a feel of the book with its blurb, but not so good for discovering new books via filtering.
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