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India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
31–40 of 297 posts
Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
#32Earlier quoted context omitted.
No. We’re different groups of people with different interests, different values, different ideas principles cultures histories views of the world. It’s good for us to be competing to explore space (and in trying to develop technological advantages in general). For countries like India it’s critical to develop their own technologies on this front. Otherwise they’ll remain eternally dependent on America, etc., for acce…
Well let's revisit this statement in 500 years. Every decade has brought the world closer. Even the recent developments (brexit, trump) are reactions to increased pace of integration. You can find kfc, coca cola in socities as diverse as Mongolia and Madagascar. It will be extremely difficult to turn the clock back on this and this will only keep on intensifying in my opinion.
It's certainly odd to measure the closeness of human societies by the proximity of coca cola dispensers.
Humanity is scientifically and materialistically closer and that will certainly continue, but the world is not closer in terms of modes of governance or ideas of how society ought to be organised.
On the contrary, 30 years ago after the fall of the Soviet Union that sentiment peaked and Fukuyama's end of history seemed plausible. Today with the nationalisation of cyberspace, we can see countless of new divides.
The US is rapidly withdrawing from global affairs, China is emerging with a competitive, alternative mode of organisation, a distinct European identity is beginning to form as a response to this particular in France, India is slowly emerging (see the very thread we're in), and Africa is a whole other matter.
But by no means does it look like the world is converging, as it did in the 90s and early 00s when we were all listening to corporate world music and cheering for Blair.
Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
#33It's a good effort by ISRO and it's scientist. Just can't understand why so many countries reinventing the wheels. Space missions should be multi-country efforts continuously as it belongs to all. We should not extend our tribal nationalistic thinking to space. Best scientist can be in any nation and more diverse the group and experience the better chances of success. I know I am just dreaming, but hopefully we can c…
No. We’re different groups of people with different interests, different values, different ideas principles cultures histories views of the world. It’s good for us to be competing to explore space (and in trying to develop technological advantages in general). For countries like India it’s critical to develop their own technologies on this front. Otherwise they’ll remain eternally dependent on America, etc., for acce…
Your post has "false dichotomy" written all over it. Of course, space exploration is an international endeavor and most space missions are highly international. Planning international space exploration missions doesn't force anyone to give up their nation, just as global trade does not imply that.
Moreover, if mankind ever expands into space, it would be rather naive to think that earth's nations would play a role there in the long run. Earth's nations change all the time, they are mere human constructs, and of course the same would happen in outer space. It would take maybe a hundred years or so for space colonies to declare their independence. And afterwards, they form larger unions again, just like on earth, because forming unions is in their interests.
> The idea of a society that big being governable is part of the science fiction.
That's far off topic, but to reply to this aspect of your post: Claiming that you can govern countries like Australia, the US, and Russia, but not the world as a whole draws some pretty arbitrary boundaries. With a federal structure, it would be no problem.
People said about every country before it was united that it will never be united. Before Germany was united, people said that it's absolutely impossible to govern such a big country and that the cultures of Prussia and Bavaria are just too different. Before the EU was funded, people said that certain European countries could never closely work together or even form a trade union and that there would always be war between some of them. Heck, probably settlers in the US also were convinced that the South and the North could never live together or be governed as one nation, because it's just too big. And so on, and so forth, you get the gist.
Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
#34Earlier quoted context omitted.
No. We’re different groups of people with different interests, different values, different ideas principles cultures histories views of the world. It’s good for us to be competing to explore space (and in trying to develop technological advantages in general). For countries like India it’s critical to develop their own technologies on this front. Otherwise they’ll remain eternally dependent on America, etc., for acce…
I will disagree with your views, scientifically we are same race and our genetic differences are insignificant. Our ancestors originated in Africa. Indeed today most nation's are a hotpot of multi-culture, language, colors, food etc. All these difference you talk about came from our tribal nationalistic mentality. Indeed the reason USA and many other countries succeeded is due to openness to embrace diversity. Single…
" the reason USA and many other countries succeeded is due to openness to embrace diversity."
- I'd say it was due to a combination colonialism of Asia, subjugation of Africa by the slave trade and world wars recking Europe. By 1950s, USA was already ahead of the rest of the world. Because it was in that position that it was able to attract immigrants which then helped to sustain its position.
There are many countries which are open to diversity - India would probably lead that list historically followed by modern Canada. But none is close to USA. On the other hand, Japan, South Korea, China and Asian tigers have done well without being open and diverse.
Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
#35Do astronauts commit sucide if they get stuck in space? Do they take gun or poison pill into space?
Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
#36Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think you are unnecessarily making this political. Even if India was successful at landing i dont think the government would count it as 'their' achievement rather would be counted as an achievement of the whole nation. And even 'non-blind' followers would celebrate, given how everyone were on edge of their seats yesterday. Also no one is bashing Nehru because he started ISRO. Calling the moon landing a government…
Considering the recent occupation, house arrest, and disabling of all cellular communications of the entire region of Kashmir, it’s worth considering the possibility that this scientific effort was made for political ends.
The thing was on its way to the Moon already by that time. The mission has been a long time making, it's pretty disrespectful to the effort of all the scientists to limit it to just distraction from Kashmir. Especially since it isn't as if showing an interest in space is a first for Modi.
Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
Considering the recent occupation, house arrest, and disabling of all cellular communications of the entire region of Kashmir, it’s worth considering the possibility that this scientific effort was made for political ends.
The thing was on its way to the Moon already by that time. The mission has been a long time making, it's pretty disrespectful to the effort of all the scientists to limit it to just distraction from Kashmir. Especially since it isn't as if showing an interest in space is a first for Modi.
Modi’s been in power for years. This is an initiative started while he was in office.
My point isn’t that it’s a distraction, but that it’s also about building party power. Kashmir is just the brightest, clearest signal regarding the goals of his administration.
Edit: While the push to complete it came in 2015, it was (see poster below) in the works as far back as 2007, and I was mistaken to think it’s directly attributable to Modi.
Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well let's revisit this statement in 500 years. Every decade has brought the world closer. Even the recent developments (brexit, trump) are reactions to increased pace of integration. You can find kfc, coca cola in socities as diverse as Mongolia and Madagascar. It will be extremely difficult to turn the clock back on this and this will only keep on intensifying in my opinion.
It's certainly odd to measure the closeness of human societies by the proximity of coca cola dispensers. Humanity is scientifically and materialistically closer and that will certainly continue, but the world is not closer in terms of modes of governance or ideas of how society ought to be organised. On the contrary, 30 years ago after the fall of the Soviet Union that sentiment peaked and Fukuyama's end of history s…
The convergence is massive and even faster than in the 90s. Languages die nearly daily (a language dies when its last speaker dies) and with them their culture, and people consume the same media and news all of the world. I'm not going to dig up some links on the net, you can do that yourself, but these are measurable phenomena.
You're thinking in short, next twenty years or so. A resurgence of nationalism is a response to globalization, but unless we give up our ways of living entirely (no capitalism, no markets, no growth) these movements will have practically no effect. Mass media alone ensure that, let alone the nature of global trading and social mobility. Think about the next two hundred years and there is no way culture on earth will not be vastly homogeneous. Whether that's good or bad I will leave open, my personal view is that all massive shifts in human development are accompanied by positive and negative effects.
Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
No. We’re different groups of people with different interests, different values, different ideas principles cultures histories views of the world. It’s good for us to be competing to explore space (and in trying to develop technological advantages in general). For countries like India it’s critical to develop their own technologies on this front. Otherwise they’ll remain eternally dependent on America, etc., for acce…
Your post has "false dichotomy" written all over it. Of course, space exploration is an international endeavor and most space missions are highly international. Planning international space exploration missions doesn't force anyone to give up their nation, just as global trade does not imply that. Moreover, if mankind ever expands into space, it would be rather naive to think that earth's nations would play a role th…
It's easy to say that it's an international initiative and ignore how we failed at others like global warming.
Re: India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Land on Moon
#40Here's [1] a data graph of the Doppler curve from Dwingeloo Radio Telescope (based in Netherlands) showing the exact moment the probe crashed into the surface of the moon. https://twitter.com/cgbassa/status/1170072672266592256
It bounced back?