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EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

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Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#31

Post by minikites »

tyri_kai_psomi wrote: post #30
cadence- wrote: post #27

Americans have been dismantling and weakening their regulatory bodies for quite a while now. The idea is that this will unshackle big corporations and allow them to innovate faster. This sounds like a great idea, until you realize that this “innovation” is most often about increasing profits. And the quality of the product is often sacrificed to increase profits. Just look at what is happening to telecommunication se…

This is a common misunderstanding I see repeated a lot. The idea isn't unshackling big corporations, it's about unshackling small to medium sized businesses and entrepreneurs. Big corps actually love regulations for the barriers to entry they create, and most of them already have a whole host of regulatory compliance teams armed and ready to dissect the next big regulation that comes. > Americans get stuck with slow…

>Big corps actually love regulations for the barriers to entry they create, and most of them already have a whole host of regulatory compliance teams armed and ready to dissect the next big regulation that comes.

So then why do big corporations spend so much time and money lobbying against regulation?

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#32

Post by rsynnott »

tyri_kai_psomi wrote: post #30
cadence- wrote: post #27

Americans have been dismantling and weakening their regulatory bodies for quite a while now. The idea is that this will unshackle big corporations and allow them to innovate faster. This sounds like a great idea, until you realize that this “innovation” is most often about increasing profits. And the quality of the product is often sacrificed to increase profits. Just look at what is happening to telecommunication se…

This is a common misunderstanding I see repeated a lot. The idea isn't unshackling big corporations, it's about unshackling small to medium sized businesses and entrepreneurs. Big corps actually love regulations for the barriers to entry they create, and most of them already have a whole host of regulatory compliance teams armed and ready to dissect the next big regulation that comes. > Americans get stuck with slow…

So, on the high end, the US is fine, and thus is does fairly well on mean speeds (top 10 on some metrics). However, if your internet in the US is bad, it's often really, _really_ bad. In areas without competition, providers still sometimes use ADSL1! (Max 8 down, In general, the tendency in most European countries has been to force wholesaling and/or LLU, and set minimum standards for both; this has generally at least wiped out ADSL1. The FCC is somewhat lighter touch.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#33

Post by AmVess »

jwr wrote: post #24

This is excellent news. The FAA has lots its credibility by rubber-stamping whatever Boeing said in recent years. This will both mean an independent review (and re-certification of what is a effectively different airplane) and additional pressure on the FAA to actually do its job.

Not recent years. Decades. FAA has been under regulatory capture by Boeing for decades.

The world ignoring anything the FAA has to say about anything is a stance that's long overdue.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#35

Post by [deleted] »

tyri_kai_psomi wrote: post #30
cadence- wrote: post #27

Americans have been dismantling and weakening their regulatory bodies for quite a while now. The idea is that this will unshackle big corporations and allow them to innovate faster. This sounds like a great idea, until you realize that this “innovation” is most often about increasing profits. And the quality of the product is often sacrificed to increase profits. Just look at what is happening to telecommunication se…

This is a common misunderstanding I see repeated a lot. The idea isn't unshackling big corporations, it's about unshackling small to medium sized businesses and entrepreneurs. Big corps actually love regulations for the barriers to entry they create, and most of them already have a whole host of regulatory compliance teams armed and ready to dissect the next big regulation that comes. > Americans get stuck with slow…

[deleted]

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#36

Post by peteradio »

tyri_kai_psomi wrote: post #30
cadence- wrote: post #27

Americans have been dismantling and weakening their regulatory bodies for quite a while now. The idea is that this will unshackle big corporations and allow them to innovate faster. This sounds like a great idea, until you realize that this “innovation” is most often about increasing profits. And the quality of the product is often sacrificed to increase profits. Just look at what is happening to telecommunication se…

This is a common misunderstanding I see repeated a lot. The idea isn't unshackling big corporations, it's about unshackling small to medium sized businesses and entrepreneurs. Big corps actually love regulations for the barriers to entry they create, and most of them already have a whole host of regulatory compliance teams armed and ready to dissect the next big regulation that comes. > Americans get stuck with slow…

I don't think its useful to say big corps vs small/medium corps without specifying industry.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#37

Post by jussij »

nolok wrote: post #18
CaliforniaKarl wrote: post #2

I think this isn't just a test of Boeing, it's a test of the FAA. If the EASA finds issues that the FAA didn't (either because they were missed, or not brought up), that'll hurt the FAA's reputation even more.

If the EASA finds real major issue that the FAA didn’t find then the FAA being the world validation office for Boeing planes is over. But I don’t think this will happen, the FAA seem to have realized how angry the rest of the world agencies are. 350 dead because they screwed up, and their first reaction was to say it was the dead pilots fault...

The FAA lost a big chunk of it's credibility in the way they handled the fist MAX 737 crash.

The fact Ethiopa insisted on sending the flight records for their MAX 737 crash to Europe and not to the US shows some serious loss of trust in the FAA had occurred.

And that was not helped when the USA was the last country to ground the aircraft.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#38

Post by jacques_chester »

rswail wrote: post #29
xxpor wrote: post #7

Frankly, this is good IMO. It should also go in reverse. The FAA should have to independently certify Airbus/Embraer too.

It should operate how the judicial systems operate in Anglo-related countries. The US SCOTUS has used legal rulings from the UK and vice versa as "guidance" to their own legal rulings, but not as authoritative. The FAA/EASA/ATSB/* should refer to each other. To quote Ronald Reagan, "Trust but Verify".

A nitpick: the usual term is "persuasive", as in "we find the argument of our brother court to be persuasive". This typically means that the foreign case does, in fact, become precedent by proxy.

For example, as an Australian law student, I read Marbury v. Madison, which was held persuasive in Australia because of the direct influence between the US constitution and Australian constitution. Another case with enormous worldwide effect is Donoghue v Stevenson, which was the beginning of modern Torts law.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#39

Post by tompccs »

rsynnott wrote: post #32
tyri_kai_psomi wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a common misunderstanding I see repeated a lot. The idea isn't unshackling big corporations, it's about unshackling small to medium sized businesses and entrepreneurs. Big corps actually love regulations for the barriers to entry they create, and most of them already have a whole host of regulatory compliance teams armed and ready to dissect the next big regulation that comes. > Americans get stuck with slow…

So, on the high end, the US is fine, and thus is does fairly well on mean speeds (top 10 on some metrics). However, if your internet in the US is bad, it's often really, _really_ bad. In areas without competition, providers still sometimes use ADSL1! (Max 8 down, In general, the tendency in most European countries has been to force wholesaling and/or LLU, and set minimum standards for both; this has generally at leas…

Some of the problems are unique to America - for instance, states each have their own regulations, as well as federal ones, which makes nationwide roll-out far costlier. You also have way more geographic concentration of homes in Europe, which makes the ROI for roll-out over a particular area way better.

UK's utilities are generally quite good (despite grumbling), which I think is because regulators focus on creating frictionless marketplaces - ie, easy to switch, providers can't obfuscate costs, proliferation of comission-based switching services.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#40

Post by mobilefriendly »

tyri_kai_psomi wrote: post #30
cadence- wrote: post #27

Americans have been dismantling and weakening their regulatory bodies for quite a while now. The idea is that this will unshackle big corporations and allow them to innovate faster. This sounds like a great idea, until you realize that this “innovation” is most often about increasing profits. And the quality of the product is often sacrificed to increase profits. Just look at what is happening to telecommunication se…

This is a common misunderstanding I see repeated a lot. The idea isn't unshackling big corporations, it's about unshackling small to medium sized businesses and entrepreneurs. Big corps actually love regulations for the barriers to entry they create, and most of them already have a whole host of regulatory compliance teams armed and ready to dissect the next big regulation that comes. > Americans get stuck with slow…

I live in a DC exurb and literally do not have land-based internet access at home. The US broadband regime is a massive failure. It delivers neither high speeds nor universal access.
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