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EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

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21–30 of 122 posts

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#21
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump attempted to nominate his personal pilot to run FAA. When it did not go trough, FAA was run by acting director until this July. Trump government seems to sell influence in government organizations to companies they are supposed to oversee, so I don't know if Stephen Dickson is step for better or worse.

When the FAA asked for a software fix after they decided there was an issue after the first crash they came to an agreement with Boeing for a January deadline. Boeing didn’t deliver, the FAA didn’t do anything. In March the second crash happened. This alone is horrible to think about.

This is what regulatory capture looks like, and Ralph Nader's goddaughter paid with her life for the cozy relationship between the FAA and Boeing. That's what Boeing's corrupting political money bought: death and failure.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#22
post #6

The EASA says there is “still no appropriate response to Angle of Attack integrity issues.” I can’t believe they haven’t got a plan yet!

I wish we had a graph of their attrition rate since the incidents occurred

Whose attrition rate? The EASA? Boeing?

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#23
post #18

I think this isn't just a test of Boeing, it's a test of the FAA. If the EASA finds issues that the FAA didn't (either because they were missed, or not brought up), that'll hurt the FAA's reputation even more.

If the EASA finds real major issue that the FAA didn’t find then the FAA being the world validation office for Boeing planes is over. But I don’t think this will happen, the FAA seem to have realized how angry the rest of the world agencies are. 350 dead because they screwed up, and their first reaction was to say it was the dead pilots fault...

The era of American exceptionalism is coming to an end and Americans are screeching from the pain. As technology leader and economic powerhouse, the US has left its cultural, political and financial footprint in Europe in the past decades but the extent of that influence is now downgraded. And the reason is inner decay.

When the wall came down in Eastern Germany, we tuned into Knight Rider and MacGyver. The A-Team and the Power Rangers were on and life seemed to change for the better as the German East experienced American liberalism after decades of authoritarianist socialism.

I glorified America growing up and as a 11 year old. In 2000, I was more excited to see the Statue of Liberty the first time than for any Christmas before. Nothing came close to seeing the city of my childhood heroes (the Ghostbusters) and seeing WTC/Empire State when driving in from JFK.

But 9/11 happened and somehow America sold its soul. Not that Gulf War or Vietnam didn't happen, but it changed everything about the tiny bits of the amazing USA that I had always imagined. Post-9/11 I ended up living for nearly 6 years in the US and all the problems became apparent to me as a growing teenager. America was not nearly as great as propaganda made it out to be.

Back home in Europe, I never once worried about health. Going to the doc was normal and expected. Emergency procedures were performed without a second thought to cost. In the US, I was billed $800 for 3 stitches when I cut my thumb (deeply) and I got lucky because university ambulance transported me.

In Europe, in my hometown of around 1 million people, I got into problems with bullies and ran into thieves/thugs and it definitely sucked.

But in the US, I experienced muggings at gun point, one mass shooting (~13 dead), one fatal stabbing on campus, one robbery in my SO's home, arson in the house across my street and one meth lab explosion... it felt absolutely surreal (happened all in Binghamton, NY - not really a prime example of a blossoming economy, I know).

In classes, people were overtly concerned with political correctness and yelled at Middle Eastern history professors for using specific "offending" terms. Also, excluding God from the evolutions lecture was a highlight. Every single international student felt cringe and embarrassment when that Midwestern girl yelled at 300 people that evolution is just a theory and intelligent design ought to be taught with as much dedication and she feels offended.

Personally, America often felt like it was run by corrupt cronies who torpedoed education where ever possible. College is a for-profit business rather than an investment into the next generation of citizens. It felt so weird and I think the social cracks that were apparent 15 years ago are now leading to structural failure in society.

There are many smart and capable people in the US. Whether they did amazing stuff for their local hospital, took part in the Apollo program or engineered comms for Lockheed Martin. I met so many amazing folks. I hope that their rational influence can be stronger again.

Now I will go back and concern myself with Europe's own massive problems. I carry the US in my heart, as I lived there for half a decade. I hope that the country is in a local minimum right now and that the path out is already in view.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#24
This is excellent news. The FAA has lots its credibility by rubber-stamping whatever Boeing said in recent years. This will both mean an independent review (and re-certification of what is a effectively different airplane) and additional pressure on the FAA to actually do its job.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#25
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish we had a graph of their attrition rate since the incidents occurred

Whose attrition rate? The EASA? Boeing?

Boeing I guess, maybe FAA. Why would ESA loose people from this?

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#26
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trump attempted to nominate his personal pilot to run FAA. When it did not go trough, FAA was run by acting director until this July. Trump government seems to sell influence in government organizations to companies they are supposed to oversee, so I don't know if Stephen Dickson is step for better or worse.

When the FAA asked for a software fix after they decided there was an issue after the first crash they came to an agreement with Boeing for a January deadline. Boeing didn’t deliver, the FAA didn’t do anything. In March the second crash happened. This alone is horrible to think about.

Or the fact that Boeing determined that the lack of a functioning AOA Disagree (by mistake, it was only operational for customers that have the AOA indicator) did not constitute a safety issue.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#27
Americans have been dismantling and weakening their regulatory bodies for quite a while now. The idea is that this will unshackle big corporations and allow them to innovate faster. This sounds like a great idea, until you realize that this “innovation” is most often about increasing profits. And the quality of the product is often sacrificed to increase profits. Just look at what is happening to telecommunication services, with big corporations growing their profits while Americans get stuck with slow and expensive service that becomes relatively worse comparing to other western countries.

Lack of proper regulation (or enforcement) might lead to short-term gains in some economic indicators, but in the long term will lead to worse quality, relative decline of America comparing to other countries, and sometimes -like in this case- avoidable deaths of hundreds of innocent people.

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#28
post #18

I think this isn't just a test of Boeing, it's a test of the FAA. If the EASA finds issues that the FAA didn't (either because they were missed, or not brought up), that'll hurt the FAA's reputation even more.

If the EASA finds real major issue that the FAA didn’t find then the FAA being the world validation office for Boeing planes is over. But I don’t think this will happen, the FAA seem to have realized how angry the rest of the world agencies are. 350 dead because they screwed up, and their first reaction was to say it was the dead pilots fault...

Sure the FAA realizes that, but does the FAA, which has been hemorrhaging expertise as they started relying on Afompany experts, instead of their own, have the capability to find all issues?

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#29
post #7

Frankly, this is good IMO. It should also go in reverse. The FAA should have to independently certify Airbus/Embraer too.

It should operate how the judicial systems operate in Anglo-related countries. The US SCOTUS has used legal rulings from the UK and vice versa as "guidance" to their own legal rulings, but not as authoritative. The FAA/EASA/ATSB/* should refer to each other.

To quote Ronald Reagan, "Trust but Verify".

Re: EASA Insists on Testing Boeing 737 Max Itself Before Lifting Ban

#30

Americans have been dismantling and weakening their regulatory bodies for quite a while now. The idea is that this will unshackle big corporations and allow them to innovate faster. This sounds like a great idea, until you realize that this “innovation” is most often about increasing profits. And the quality of the product is often sacrificed to increase profits. Just look at what is happening to telecommunication se…

This is a common misunderstanding I see repeated a lot. The idea isn't unshackling big corporations, it's about unshackling small to medium sized businesses and entrepreneurs. Big corps actually love regulations for the barriers to entry they create, and most of them already have a whole host of regulatory compliance teams armed and ready to dissect the next big regulation that comes.

> Americans get stuck with slow and expensive service that becomes relatively worse comparing to other western countries.

Internet speeds in most suburban, and urban locations in the US have dramatically increased as of late due to increased threat of competition (namely Google Fiber, which prompted AT&T to start heavily developing Fiber, which prompted the Spectrums of the world to increase speeds) and could be further accelerated by deregulation. Regulations are actually the primary reason that keeps cable companies in their monopolistic/oligarlistic positions.

As far as I am aware, the only western countries that have surpassed the US in internet speeds and stability for the majority of its populace are actually east, in countries like S.Korea and Japan.

Interestingly enough, Japan is mostly voluntarily self regulated.

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