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Another Blow for the Future of Corals

theatlantic.com

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Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#11

Post by EGreg »

inimino wrote: post #10
kiba wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Majority will trade distant future for today's comfort. We only have hopes on minority warriors and scientists who see this sign and force us to take action before it's too late. There are probably a series of decisions that we could have make as a worldwide civilization that does not involves the notion of sacrifice whatsoever.

I really don't think so. The cheap and easy thing has always been to burn the fossil fuels, cut down the forests, fish until there are no more fish, and hunt until there are no more prey. The only hope for the future is if we care for it.

What about emerging countries increasing women’s education and having fewer children much later?

Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#12

Post by inimino »

EGreg wrote: post #11
inimino wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don't think so. The cheap and easy thing has always been to burn the fossil fuels, cut down the forests, fish until there are no more fish, and hunt until there are no more prey. The only hope for the future is if we care for it.

What about emerging countries increasing women’s education and having fewer children much later?

What about it?

Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#13

Post by ds0hhz »

inimino wrote: post #12
EGreg wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about emerging countries increasing women’s education and having fewer children much later?

What about it?

Instead of beating around the bush and choose easy targets such as fossil fuels and forests, do something about it.

Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#14

Post by sifar »

diveanon wrote: post #2

I have the good fortune to work on an island surrounded by "super corals". The spawning this year seemed to be synchronized and right on schedule. Life is adaptable, and while that does not excuse our behavior it does give me hope for the future of our reefs. Reefs are the oldest ecosystems on the planet, they will survive the damage we are doing to the planet. Our species however may not. If you are at all intereste…

Me/my kids are fascinated by corals. Can you please suggest any books/resources to study and understand them ?

Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#15

Post by mythrwy »

adrianN wrote: post #5

The reefs are already lost. We've already emitted enough GHG to raise temperatures sufficiently to kill most of them and there are no signs that we'll stay below 2° of warming. At 2° all coral reefs will die.

Then how do we explain the huge number of fossil reefs in the geological record from times when temperatures were much warmer and C02 levels were around 10 times as high as they are today?

Besides if the temperature warms 2 degrees won't corals adapted to tropical waters colonize currently colder waters that are at that point perfectly suited?

Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#16

Post by mikestew »

mythrwy wrote: post #15
adrianN wrote: post #5

The reefs are already lost. We've already emitted enough GHG to raise temperatures sufficiently to kill most of them and there are no signs that we'll stay below 2° of warming. At 2° all coral reefs will die.

Then how do we explain the huge number of fossil reefs in the geological record from times when temperatures were much warmer and C02 levels were around 10 times as high as they are today? Besides if the temperature warms 2 degrees won't corals adapted to tropical waters colonize currently colder waters that are at that point perfectly suited?

won't corals adapted to tropical waters colonize currently colder waters that are at that point perfectly suited?

What, they just call up American Vanlines to come pack their shit and move them 10 degrees north? No, temperature change will happen quickly enough that the coral will die before they migrate.

Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#17

Post by mythrwy »

mikestew wrote: post #16
mythrwy wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then how do we explain the huge number of fossil reefs in the geological record from times when temperatures were much warmer and C02 levels were around 10 times as high as they are today? Besides if the temperature warms 2 degrees won't corals adapted to tropical waters colonize currently colder waters that are at that point perfectly suited?

won't corals adapted to tropical waters colonize currently colder waters that are at that point perfectly suited? What, they just call up American Vanlines to come pack their shit and move them 10 degrees north? No, temperature change will happen quickly enough that the coral will die before they migrate.

Corals produce polyps that are mobile early in life and wash all over. They won't have any trouble moving if temperatures change. In fact it's already been observed to happen.

https://www.nature.com/news/2011/110121/full/news.2011.33.ht...

Corals are not going to die out in 30 years, 50 years, probably not before humans die out. Corals have been around for a long time and are highly adaptable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fossil_Coral_Reef

For fun you can look at temps and C02 levels during Devonian period. No glaciers, much warmer than today. Very high C02 because carbon we are burning today had not been sequestered yet. Yet a coral reef was formed, a big one.

Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#18

Post by adrianN »

mythrwy wrote: post #17
mikestew wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

won't corals adapted to tropical waters colonize currently colder waters that are at that point perfectly suited? What, they just call up American Vanlines to come pack their shit and move them 10 degrees north? No, temperature change will happen quickly enough that the coral will die before they migrate.

Corals produce polyps that are mobile early in life and wash all over. They won't have any trouble moving if temperatures change. In fact it's already been observed to happen. https://www.nature.com/news/2011/110121/full/news.2011.33.ht... Corals are not going to die out in 30 years, 50 years, probably not before humans die out. Corals have been around for a long time and are highly adaptable. https://en.wikipedia.or…

You'd better call up the IPCC and tell them of your findings, because they believe that 99% of the coral will be dead in a 2° world with high confidence. Currently our emissions are on a path for much stronger warming that even that.

Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#19

Post by mythrwy »

adrianN wrote: post #18
mythrwy wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Corals produce polyps that are mobile early in life and wash all over. They won't have any trouble moving if temperatures change. In fact it's already been observed to happen. https://www.nature.com/news/2011/110121/full/news.2011.33.ht... Corals are not going to die out in 30 years, 50 years, probably not before humans die out. Corals have been around for a long time and are highly adaptable. https://en.wikipedia.or…

You'd better call up the IPCC and tell them of your findings, because they believe that 99% of the coral will be dead in a 2° world with high confidence. Currently our emissions are on a path for much stronger warming that even that.

Appeal to authority isn't really an argument though.

I've laid the fact I know of out, you are free to believe what you want.

Re: Another Blow for the Future of Corals

#20

Post by inimino »

ds0hhz wrote: post #13
inimino wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about it?

Instead of beating around the bush and choose easy targets such as fossil fuels and forests, do something about it.

Ah, so... you think more people should be working on this? I'm under the impression everyone in those poor countries with high birth rates is already working to move themselves or their country into a better economic position, and when they do, birth rates will fall and resource consumption will still go up, because rich people consume more resources, even when there are fewer of them. How does that solve the problem of the so-called "easy targets" like fossil fuels and forests?
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