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Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

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Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#301

Post by madisfun »

Living in Europe, I have yet to see a smart navigation app, which would allow to take into account:

- tolls and fuel consumption (Via Michelin is great at offering 2-3 routes with different and realistic costs, but the app is an ad-nest and their navigator is bad; Here can avoid tolls but the UI is bad; Google Maps is useless if you want to optimize the costs).

- altitude changes (a marginally shorter road which has to climb and descent 1000 m / 3000 ft is not the same as doing extra distance on the flat ground).

- the shape of the road, prefer wider and more direct roads (there are many narrow and extremely curvy roads that can't be driven fast, and some may be very stressful to drive).

- the realistic median speed as an estimator (not the speed limit; sometimes it is set unrealistically high; also do not assume that all tarmac roads are equivalent).

- local and temporary traffic restrictions (respect car-free hours in some areas and restrictions on a particular kind of vehicle or engine).

- eventual stops during long trips

Google Maps is far from an ideal navigation app at this point. The only reason it is used, IMO, is the abysmall UI experience in built-in car navigators. (Anecdotal evidence: I rented a car last week, it took me five minutes to enter destination, and then I couldn't figure out how to interrupt navigation. Eventually just used the phone to drive around).

Tl;dr: Dear Google, Waze, etc., distance is not everything.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#302

Post by marble-drink »

sdfasdfsafasf wrote: post #267
marble-drink wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't participate in "stop and go" by positioning my car far back from the car in front and selecting an appropriate gear such that my car will keep rolling with just the engine idle. It means you don't waste any fuel or clutch actuations and it's just much easier.

until some genius decides to switch to your lane to get further ahead in life a whole 3 yards.

Don't worry about it. It's easier to just stay in gear than try to compete with everyone else trying to get a car length ahead. If you have to go through such an ordeal every day then reducing stress should be your main priority.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#303

Post by perl4ever »

waylandsmithers wrote: post #198
msluyter wrote: post #122

I try to minimize not total driving time, but something I call "agony" (term borrowed from Hipmunk). So, I'll take meandering side streets over a stop-and-go highway if it means I'm moving most of the time, even if the total wallclock time is greater. Or I'll take 3 right turns to avoid a harrowing left hand turn. Anything that keeps my blood pressure down. AKA, "long cuts." Assuming there are at least some out there…

Yes! Something here in Boston that Google and Waze never take into account is that there are some left turns that at rush hour that can really only be accomplished by the most aggressive drivers. Sorry, I'm not doing that.

I don't understand why they don't fix either one so it stops giving you left turns onto busy highways at intersections without traffic lights. It's just idiotic. And surely there are already guidance systems for delivery companies that optimize routes with all right turns. That would be a nice checkbox option along with avoiding tolls.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#304

Post by perl4ever »

nradov wrote: post #4
valiant-comma wrote: post #2

When these articles show up now and again, it’s not clear to me why the various impacted cities don’t choose to ban through traffic. Some articles have implied that this is not possible. Los Altos did this a while back[1]. Is there a legal issue the communities surrounding Los Angeles want to avoid, that Los Altos simply took the risk on? [1] https://slate.com/business/2017/06/suburbs-finally-figured-o...

It turns out than bans on through traffic aren't legally enforceable. The signs are merely advisory.

I see a lot of streets where I live that have signs saying no trucks except local delivery. I wonder at what level that is instituted and enforced.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#305

Post by perl4ever »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #75
s_Hogg wrote: post #30

LA is a very strange place to me - I read about all this havoc, but whenever I fly in there and do stuff it seems fairly quiet and almost somnabulent.

Try commuting into the greater LA area during rush hour. It’s really something else. Once I was taking my then-fiancé to LAX for an 11:30am flight. About 2-3 hours into the drive, we were on the 105 in completely stopped traffic. A man in a convertible next to us began to absolutely lose it, smacking the steering wheel with loud, desperate yelling “ARRGH!!” again and again. We decided he must have been late to a mand…

I have never tried to drive into NYC, but when I think back on being there, there were a lot of cars...I guess. So someone drives there, and lots of them. I don't want to, but I wonder what it's like, and just how the people in the parking spaces managed to obtain them.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#306

Post by perl4ever »

thehappypm wrote: post #259

I often wonder if we ought to try to double the US's highway capacity. It's pretty obvious that the American appetite for public transportation is pretty low, and that car ownership in our continent is here to stay. Why not lean into that, focus on the roads, build bus lanes for public transit?

I remember a long time ago reading an article about the bus system in Curitiba, Brazil, which supposedly was innovative and worked particularly well at a much lower cost than subways, but more efficiently than most buses.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rede_Integrada_de_Transporte

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#307

Post by perl4ever »

pie420 wrote: post #212
devit wrote: post #162

The obvious solutions seem to be either: 1. Add enough speedbumps, unsynchronized traffic lights or even unnecessary timed barriers to make the route slow enough that it's no longer optimal 2. Add cameras that fine anyone who doesn't have a permit to pass, which would be given to residents for free and anyone who pays a sufficiently high price

that would make sense if those were private roads. public roads belong to the public. I have the right to use the road in your neighborhood just as much as you do.

As is well known to any homeowner, typically anyone who owns property has certain responsibilities to care for the public property adjoining it. For instance, you have to clear snow off in a timely manner where I live. Isn't it logical that if you have responsibilities for public property next to where you live, that you may also have some rights as well?

I think you are assuming a naive dichotomy between public and private that doesn't reflect the way things actually work.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#308

Post by jborichevskiy »

perl4ever wrote: post #305
TimTheTinker wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Try commuting into the greater LA area during rush hour. It’s really something else. Once I was taking my then-fiancé to LAX for an 11:30am flight. About 2-3 hours into the drive, we were on the 105 in completely stopped traffic. A man in a convertible next to us began to absolutely lose it, smacking the steering wheel with loud, desperate yelling “ARRGH!!” again and again. We decided he must have been late to a mand…

I have never tried to drive into NYC, but when I think back on being there, there were a lot of cars...I guess. So someone drives there, and lots of them. I don't want to, but I wonder what it's like, and just how the people in the parking spaces managed to obtain them.

The traffic in NYC is bad but I think there is more of a natural equilibrium that arises from the fact that if traffic gets bad enough, some portion of people will switch to the alternatives (public transport, biking, even walking), making traffic less terrible and equalizing everything. People don't really have that option in Los Angeles so it seems everyone is just stuck driving.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#309

Post by somehnguy »

davinic wrote: post #231
somehnguy wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not quite the same thing but I've contributed a correction to Google maps before. My motivation was that my address on maps was in the middle of a cornfield and I was tired of explaining exactly where my house really was when new people came over.

Have you tried using Plus Codes as a solution to this? https://plus.codes/

No. Most people I know would have no idea what a plus code is, it was much easier to just edit the address on the map and move on.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#310

Post by Steve44 »

krn wrote: post #114
Steve44 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The main difference between Waze and Google Maps is that Waze uses real time traffic data. Google Maps has real time traffic data and the accuracy is staggering. I occasionally use Google Maps for navigation in the car and it even highlights traffic stationary at traffic lights and temporary road works as I’m approaching. This level or real time detail really amazed me. I’ve not spent any time looking onto how they…

> Google Maps has real time traffic data and the accuracy is staggering. But does Google Maps use real time traffic data to calculate the most optimal route in the same way as Waze does? As I understand, that's the main difference between the two.

I’ve never used Wayz so can’t compare but quite a few other comments note how aggressive Wayz is at re-routing.

At points where there are multiple route options it will indicate how many minutes faster or slower each option is.

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