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The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

theatlantic.com

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Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#51

Post by mikeash »

alfromspace wrote: post #10

The biggest factor in America's high divorce rates is, by far, the advent of no-fault divorce starting in the 70s. I think there's also something to the cultural tropes and propaganda we've seen since then portraying marriage as dull, monotonous, and oppressive while lifting up devoting one's life to an office job, travel, and 'exciting' flings as the path to self-fulfillment. When nothing could really be further fro…

If so, that seems to reveal a pent-up desire for divorce that was suppressed by making it legally difficult. Having the government force people to stay together when they don’t want it seems like a bad thing.

Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#52

Post by thanatropism »

tenebrisalietum wrote: post #36
033803throwaway wrote: post #27

Marriage is a wonderful institution and the children that come from it are the greatest gift you can be given. Our culture tells us the opposite. But our culture is insane and wants you to be an isolated, rootless, consumer wage slave.

> Marriage is a wonderful institution and the children that come from it are the greatest gift you can be given. This is true only if the finances are there to support it and both people really want it. In which case any "institution" can be considered wonderful and the fruit of it a "gift." Most people can't get out of the consumer wage slave trap, it's their only opportunity or the only one they know about or can u…

Modulo taxes, how is a DINK couple worse off than two individuals each living in their own place? There's significant economies of scale.

Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#53

Post by akavi »

docbrown wrote: post #42
akavi wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The algorithm used doesn't need to be any good at matching people for online dating to increase your chance of finding a suitable partner. A system which showed people to each other in a totally randomized way would still drastically increases the number of people you can superficially evaluate, and even a tinder style photos + blurb profile is rich in personality/cultural clues to base evaluation on.

>A system which showed people to each other in a totally randomized way would still drastically increases the number of people you can superficially evaluate Is this really the ultimate goal for online dating? To expose us to a plethora of options in order to choose which one is best fit. It reminds of how Hot or Not could be seen as an early type of online dating that exposed us to randomized people, although withou…

The ultimate goal of the user is to find a suitable partner. Whether you can achieve that goal better with sophisticated selection of who you show to whom isn't obvious to me either way.

(Anecdotally, having used multiple apps, there is one that seemed to effectively "learn" my preferences and was successful in showing me women I was interested in meeting at seeming better than chance. But that's a single data point, and it's possible I'm "oddly predictable" from their model's perspective)

Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#54

Post by oblongx »

_b8r0 wrote: post #25
cliffy wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Raising kids is hard enough with two dedicated parents. Marriage at least comes with the promise of staying together in the long term. Makes it a little harder for one partner to just leave. I have two kids. The idea of raising them by myself seems nearly impossible. Maybe it's doable if you're already independently wealthy or can heavily rely on nearby family or both. Still doesn't sound as healthy as having two ded…

> Marriage at least comes with the promise of staying together in the long term. I'm not sure the divorce rate agrees that this constitutes a promise.

What is the separation rate of non-married couples?

Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#55

Post by JakeTheAndroid »

docbrown wrote: post #42
akavi wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The algorithm used doesn't need to be any good at matching people for online dating to increase your chance of finding a suitable partner. A system which showed people to each other in a totally randomized way would still drastically increases the number of people you can superficially evaluate, and even a tinder style photos + blurb profile is rich in personality/cultural clues to base evaluation on.

>A system which showed people to each other in a totally randomized way would still drastically increases the number of people you can superficially evaluate Is this really the ultimate goal for online dating? To expose us to a plethora of options in order to choose which one is best fit. It reminds of how Hot or Not could be seen as an early type of online dating that exposed us to randomized people, although withou…

I doubt it's the ultimate goal, but the baseline it provides is probably better than the one without such an option. I rarely feel like going out by myself to do something, so if it wasn't for dating apps I wouldn't think my pool of available women was very large, and in turn I might be contently or unhappily married today.

Instead, I have what appears to be never ending choices which makes it very unlikely I'll ever feel confident committing because 'the next one could be better', leaving me contently or unhappily single.

So, it seems like a wash now that I frame it in my own life...

Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#56

Post by strikelaserclaw »

dr_dshiv wrote: post #14
alfromspace wrote: post #10

The biggest factor in America's high divorce rates is, by far, the advent of no-fault divorce starting in the 70s. I think there's also something to the cultural tropes and propaganda we've seen since then portraying marriage as dull, monotonous, and oppressive while lifting up devoting one's life to an office job, travel, and 'exciting' flings as the path to self-fulfillment. When nothing could really be further fro…

"Marriage is miserable. But not as bad as divorce or never getting married." Is that the idea?

The order goes 1)Happy marriage 2)Being Single 3)Shitty marriage

Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#57

Post by monkeynotes »

paggle wrote: post #33
033803throwaway wrote: post #27

Marriage is a wonderful institution and the children that come from it are the greatest gift you can be given. Our culture tells us the opposite. But our culture is insane and wants you to be an isolated, rootless, consumer wage slave.

Seriously. I used to be on a high flying career path and was pretty happy about it. Then I had kids and realized I never knew what happiness was. I have about $2m and will be going to stay at home dad soon. Now everything at work seems like such utter bullshit. Who cares if this code compiles or not. We’re all just useless worms on a piece of dust. I’m going to spend my femtosecond with my kids.

Elephant in the room is the $2m in the bank. This alone affords you the perspective to value family life over all else. If you were struggling to make rent and feed your kids you might find that children are a burden and stress. I don't think this would necessarily make you love them any less, but some of my friends have warned me off of deciding to have children because of the financial strain that comes part-and-parcel for the average person with kids.

Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#58

Post by agilebyte »

monkeynotes wrote: post #50
dominotw wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Marriage is a wonderful institution and the children that come from it are the greatest gift you can be given. Perhaps this is true for you personally. How do you know that this an "universal truth".

I translate 'marriage' to 'mature monogamous partnership' and I think scientific research shows that people who have a happy long-term partnership live longer than lonely single individuals. Perhaps especially true if children are part of that partnership. I don't think simply being married equates to happiness though. The institution is probably irrelevant when held up to the quality of the actual relationship.

Correct, it's having a partner that has an impact on our wellbeing. Also, last time I checked psychology textbooks having children had a neutral effect.

Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#59

Post by paggle »

monkeynotes wrote: post #57
paggle wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously. I used to be on a high flying career path and was pretty happy about it. Then I had kids and realized I never knew what happiness was. I have about $2m and will be going to stay at home dad soon. Now everything at work seems like such utter bullshit. Who cares if this code compiles or not. We’re all just useless worms on a piece of dust. I’m going to spend my femtosecond with my kids.

Elephant in the room is the $2m in the bank. This alone affords you the perspective to value family life over all else. If you were struggling to make rent and feed your kids you might find that children are a burden and stress. I don't think this would necessarily make you love them any less, but some of my friends have warned me off of deciding to have children because of the financial strain that comes part-and-pa…

I recognize that my situation is not normal. But I see people around with me with much more who are still hunting for more.

Re: The divorce rate has fallen because the demographics of marriage have changed

#60

Post by ropiwqefjnpoa »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #48
ropiwqefjnpoa wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One reason is it offers legal protections so a disadvantaged mate isn't left with nothing. Especially in the case of a couple where one isn't working, perhaps to care for children.

Your spouse also gets to collect half of your social security benefit (with no impact to you) if that is higher than their benefit if you were married at least 10 years.

Many people view marriage as just a religious function, but it's really a legal one. It's why you have the "power vested in me" by whatever is the governmental law authority of the area.
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