11–20 of 348 posts
The "five demands, no less" itself is impossible for HKG. EB itself is already dead months ago. This will only embolden they rioters.
10 dollars on 0907 will be even worse.
I don't think Beijing anticipated or endorsed this. In context of Lams leaked resignation remarks yesterday, it looks like Lam is going rogue. She's setting herself up to be replaced via disobedience, because all signs pointed to Emergency Regulations Ordinance being invoked if protest continues. Her legacy is already ruined, but I think she doesn't have the stomach to double down that far. Beijing specifically instr…
Lam’s family has British citizenship. That means she may be able to share her side of the story down the road.
Her situation might seem reasonable, forgivable, even, once she shares the facts. Activating the ERO, however, would be unforgivable.
I don't think Beijing anticipated or endorsed this. In context of Lams leaked resignation remarks yesterday, it looks like Lam is going rogue. She's setting herself up to be replaced via disobedience, because all signs pointed to Emergency Regulations Ordinance being invoked if protest continues. Her legacy is already ruined, but I think she doesn't have the stomach to double down that far. Beijing specifically instr…
The difference between then and now is the drastic shift we have undergone as a human consciousness (recommended reading: Marshall McLuhan: Understanding Media)
If the medium is the message as it were, the message is and always has been the audience. The audience is watching from a whole new vantage point and we have greater agency over what we see than ever before But the greatest difference is that nobody is any longer answering the phones and the masters in their bunkers are simply yelling into empty receivers
The sea change has already happened, it just hasn't been processed and rationalized yet. We've already won and the triumph comes in seven billion unique flavours that ultimately boil down to one: free your mind
Hong Kong is proof of this fact and all rest is details which will begin a chain reaction spreading over the world like a flood -- all the pretence and deception washed away in a torrent of coloured raindrops, one for each human soul alive in the here and now
-- I concur with your splendid analysis dirtyid mind you, highly astute; wanted to share my psychedelic spin
Edit: this place is brutal for arguments not based on cautious rationalism; hasn't anyone listened to the advice of Seal? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Fc67yQsPqQ
What I'm telling you is individualism matters now more than ever and we've finally got a way to amplify the poor fuckin individual to the nth degree. Do you suppose that poor bastard Tank man would've been turned to soup if he had a twitter feed to spread his message?
Five demands, not one less. 五大訴求，缺一不可。
Can someone translate / explain this ?
From the article:
“Apart from the formal withdrawal of the legislation, the protesters have asked for the government to set up a commission of inquiry to investigate police conduct in tackling the protests, grant amnesty to those who have been arrested, stop characterising the protests as riots, and restart the city’s stalled political reform process.”
All that said, this is just a slogan. Different protesters put weight on different elements of this menu. Each concession takes people off the street. Given how reasonable many of the demands are, it makes sense for someone to be an adult in the room to Xi’s pettiness.
Five demands, not one less. 五大訴求，缺一不可。
https://youtu.be/9bAoq7k3tZ0 No seriously, these demands are a joke and not constructive. If anything it's just being used as an excuse to cause more chaos. I'm trying to keep this comment as a logical opinion since I know hn isn't a place for flamed political views
Five demands, not one less. 五大訴求，缺一不可。
There's the usual boilerplate about releasing arrested demonstrators, arresting the cops who bashed them up, and sacking the government.
There are two big demands. The first is withdrawing this bill, which has reportedly been granted. That's a big deal. The communists have let the "terrorists" win.
The second demand is Australian quality democracy in Hong Kong. If they get that, it will be a massive, world historical deal.
At least everyone now has an excuse to stop throwing Molotov cocktails.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can someone translate / explain this ?
> Can someone translate / explain [five demands, not one less]? From the article: “Apart from the formal withdrawal of the legislation, the protesters have asked for the government to set up a commission of inquiry to investigate police conduct in tackling the protests, grant amnesty to those who have been arrested, stop characterising the protests as riots, and restart the city’s stalled political reform process.” A…
Fifth, I can understand and dialogue can start and bickering in legislation, whatever, depending on definition this is achievable, but if you expect a democracy overnight then I have a strong urge to post a link to a music video.
Hense, as per my comments below, demanding all five demands to be satisfied is not constructive and to some degree immature.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can someone translate / explain this ?
> Can someone translate / explain [five demands, not one less]? From the article: “Apart from the formal withdrawal of the legislation, the protesters have asked for the government to set up a commission of inquiry to investigate police conduct in tackling the protests, grant amnesty to those who have been arrested, stop characterising the protests as riots, and restart the city’s stalled political reform process.” A…
Full democracy is a legitimate demand but one that you need to be extremely optimistic, to say the least, to believe that the central government will agree to budge on.
On the other hand, demands regarding rioting are unreasonable. There objectively has been rioting going on and no government will accept to send the message that it is acceptable to throw petrol bombs or to ransack government buildings, or to use violence in general. The only leeway in these cases is usually the penalty courts hand: Very heavy to send a message or relatively light to appease.
If the economy suffers too much, there will be real internal pressure against protesters, especially against any violence.
If the bill is indeed withdrawn it allows protesters to stop while claiming a victory. This does not mean giving up on broader democratic demands but allows them to catch their breath and ponder a long term strategy.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Can someone translate / explain [five demands, not one less]? From the article: “Apart from the formal withdrawal of the legislation, the protesters have asked for the government to set up a commission of inquiry to investigate police conduct in tackling the protests, grant amnesty to those who have been arrested, stop characterising the protests as riots, and restart the city’s stalled political reform process.” A…
The problem is that some of these demands are unrealistic and some are downright unreasonable. Full democracy is a legitimate demand but one that you need to be extremely optimistic, to say the least, to believe that the central government will agree to budge on. On the other hand, demands regarding rioting are unreasonable. There objectively has been rioting going on and no government will accept to send the message…
I believe most protesters would agree with that. The fear is authorities using riot laws against peaceful protesters.
In this, again, there is reasonable compromise.