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Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

lamag.com

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Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#251

Post by scruple »

saltminer wrote: post #249
scruple wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, but, Google Maps has speedtrap warnings, too, though.

In my experience, they're never accurate. In fact, it's almost laughable how inaccurate they are. Google really expects me to believe that US-1 in NJ is going to have speed traps? A highway where cops regularly do the Jersey Shuffle at 90+ MPH with no emergency to justify doing 25+ over the limit? Yeah right. It's one thing when it happens once in VA (a state I'm used to seeing lots of speed traps in) and there is no…

It seems to be based on self-reporting, so I'm sure it's 80% worthless.

But, the whole reason I brought this up in the first place is because: 1) Google Maps is as mainstream of a maps app as one can find, and it has speed trap reporting, and it will also try to re-route you around gridlock, which I personally find to be little more than a pointless exercise in frustration, and, 2) I noticed that it (speed trap reporting) was actually quite accurate, surprisingly so, in fact, on _a_ recent trip along the I-5 north and then again south through Kern and Kings county (which are notorious for their speed traps, Kings specifically).

I don't generally speed fast enough to get pulled over, I set my cruise control at 7mph over the speed limit on the highway. It's still nice to know that there may be a speed trap coming up, especially if you're driving through one of the perpetually-under-construction zones on a California highway.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#252

Post by [deleted] »

soneil wrote: post #210
HillaryBriss wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The police would not be required to add resources to enforce these laws. But without enforcement the signs would make very little difference to LA drivers.

The whole premise of the article is that it only needs to coerce Waze’ routing. If the glut of traffic is just following the blue line, the minority that route themselves shouldn’t be enough to cause problems - or at least, they apparently weren’t pre-waze.

[deleted]

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#253

Post by scruple »

lvturner wrote: post #145
scruple wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, but, Google Maps has speedtrap warnings, too, though.

I may be mistaken, but I think only in certain locations - I've certainly never been able to use it (maybe I just haven't found out how to turn it on)

I just observed one day that it was turned on. I don't recall when, but I do recall where. I was on the I-15 driving north from the Lake Elsinore area towards Corona and saw a weird icon on the map. Had my wife check it out and we learned that it was speed trap notifications.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#254

Post by soneil »

HillaryBriss wrote: post #230
floatingatoll wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If drivers are not routed into residential areas by Waze as there are no thru routes for Waze to use, then they will be on their own to seek out and find ways to avoid highways and risk police citing them for taking residential zone shortcuts in the process. It won’t stop every driver, but it will curb the majority of them from ever finding or using residential zones as a bypass.

my humble guess is that the genie is out of the bottle: the vast majority of these LA drivers are daily commuters. now that these drivers are used to taking these routes, most of these residential neighborhoods will remain saturated permanently. removing the routes from Waze won't relieve much traffic pressure.

The article mentions a gentleman that somehow 'disabled' his street in the waze map editor, and described the effect as a tap being turned off. I think that's the goal here. Not "no traffic", but not "drinking from the hosepipe" either - that's what arterials are designed for.

Ultimately, if it can't be tamed by more tactful means, the proper solution will be to close one end of these routes so the go from being posted as NTT, to actually being NTT. Ruin it for everyone, and see if anyone ever catches on that their selfishness has consequences.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#255

Post by brewdad »

tidenly wrote: post #49
beowulfey wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s generally accepted that more lanes does not equal less traffic, and can often lead to the opposite effect due to the effect of induced demand [1]. I personally believe providing multiple alternative transport options is more effective but obviously that’s a matter of opinion... [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induced_demand

Serious question but is there a reason more isn't invested in public transport? I've only ever lived in the UK before Tokyo but America is rich enough I don't see why they can't do what those places do.

Because a nickel of my tax dollars might go to help someone else. Can't have that. I'm a rugged individualist surviving completely on my own in a country of 350 million people.

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#256

Post by floatingatoll »

nix0n wrote: post #246
floatingatoll wrote: post #150

It’s disappointing to see LADOT neglecting to use a road management tool already at their disposal to stop Waze’s abuse of their residential zones: No Thru Traffic. Posting NTT signs at entry points into residential neighborhoods and specifying even as little as a $5 fine would make entry for thru routing unlawful, stopping Waze. Whether or not the city enforces these signs would be irrelevant, as long as the traffic…

In Boston, Waze and Google Maps will often suggest routes that are illegal, whether it's an NTT zone, a completely closed road, or no-left-turn violations.

I encourage you to sign up as a Waze route editor and submit an annotation to the segments of your routes that are illegal/invalid with photo evidence, both to improve the quality of their directions and to ensure that the Waze editors are not corrupting the dataset in order to get faster travel directions. If you find your edits overturned, write letters@lamag.com & btd@boston.gov — they will both very much want to know that Waze editors discouraged reporting of illegal routing!

For Google Maps, here are the directions for reporting illegal/invalid routing directions with photo evidence: https://support.google.com/maps/answer/6194894

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#257

Post by someguydave »

brewdad wrote: post #255
tidenly wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question but is there a reason more isn't invested in public transport? I've only ever lived in the UK before Tokyo but America is rich enough I don't see why they can't do what those places do.

Because a nickel of my tax dollars might go to help someone else. Can't have that. I'm a rugged individualist surviving completely on my own in a country of 350 million people.

Why can't people cooperate outside of government?

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#258

Post by [deleted] »

paulcole wrote: post #151
wccrawford wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" they just don't want to be feeling they are making no progress." I think you may have just convinced me to use Waze instead of Google Maps. I'd much rather relieve the stress of driving a bit than save a few minutes of time. Well, actually, I'd rather not drive at all. But seeing as that isn't really an option, I'll settle for making it less stressful.

I’m 36 and have lived in a mix of rural and urban areas of America and I never learned to drive and have never driven a car. Just want to make the point that not driving is really an option, just one that most people look for a way to avoid. It’s all a matter of priorities and as much as most people say they hate driving/traffic, very few actually do anything about it.

[deleted]

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#259

Post by thehappypm »

I often wonder if we ought to try to double the US's highway capacity. It's pretty obvious that the American appetite for public transportation is pretty low, and that car ownership in our continent is here to stay. Why not lean into that, focus on the roads, build bus lanes for public transit?

Re: Traffic apps turned L.A.’s neighborhoods into ”shortcuts”

#260

Post by Dylan16807 »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #132
Dylan16807 wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They made a decision not to make the roads objectively worse to thwart abusers. I think calling that a design problem they brought on themselves is unfair.

It's not objectively worse, any more than road diets make streets objectively worse, or sidewalks, or protected bike lanes, or speed limits. Making roads worse for through traffic makes them better for other uses. It comes down to what your priorities are, and right now, through design, they're choosing to prioritize the very through traffic they're complaining about. It's not unfair, and it's accurate. The design de…

Road diets, sidewalks, bike lanes, and (correctly done) speed limits all have very nice features.

Blocking exits does not in any way improve the road itself.

It just inconveniences people that are improperly cutting through more than normal drivers.

The fact that through traffic is technically possible does not mean it is 'prioritized'.

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