Ask HN: How Do You Read? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#51

Post by guidoism » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:00 PM UTC

axiom92 wrote: post #37

guidoism wrote: post #16

Great question! In my fourth decade of life I’m finally figuring out the optimal way to do this myself. I’ve forgotten so so many books over the years that I supposedly read. Read How to Read a Book: The Classic Guide to Intelligent Reading by Mortimer Adler. ( https://www.amazon.com/How-Read-Book-Classic-Intelligent/dp/... ) I’ve given this book to a bunch of people on my teams as it also helps with communicating id…

> One big big big thing I learned from the book is to not read a non-fiction book like it was a novel. Do you mean to say: "is to read a non-fiction book like it was a novel"?

The opposite. Non-fiction books should be read in multiple passes, like a video encoder.

- First pass: Understand the structure, important words (from index), some interesting passages.

- Second pass: Read it all the way through, don't worry if you don't understand stuff

- Third pass: Look up stuff that you didn't understand from the previous pass and read it again in order to understand them.

- Four pass: Read it concurrently with other related books to try to truly understand the topic

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#52

Post by ellius » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:01 PM UTC

kprkpr wrote: post #33

_____s wrote: post #24

In my opinion, reading is more for shaping your thoughts over time. I generally don't read for recall value except for technical things, and even there, it's better to build a good mental model of the subject through a combination of reading and exercises, then use a book as a reference. For non-technical books, I've very rarely seen any value in taking comprehensive notes (except highlights). I read those on a Kindl…

> In my opinion, reading is more for shaping your thoughts over time. Absolutely agree. I often liken reading (at least reading fiction) to the leaking basket fable [0]. I'm not sure of it's origin but the linked description is in the context of reading Buddhist spritual texts. This mindset has also made reading much more enjoyable for me, because I've stopped caring whether or not I can instantly recall details of b…

On the other hand, recalling the books and passages that really resonate with you is useful and pleasant. Schopenhauer said, "Any book which is at all important should be re-read immediately." I agree with the recommendations of "How to Read a Book." I also really like Montaigne and Seneca, who advocate not reading in a manic fashion but rather finding the books that speak to you deeply and re-reading them frequently. There will always be more content than you can consume, and while I value curiosity and exploration, there is also a lot of value in absorbing the most important lessons deeply. It also helps you weaken your brain's inborn novelty addiction and encourages prolonged effort towards a goal (deep understanding), which is a better route to satisfaction than vacuuming up every new experience you can find.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#53

Post by Stratoscope » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:01 PM UTC

axiom92 wrote: post #37

guidoism wrote: post #16

Great question! In my fourth decade of life I’m finally figuring out the optimal way to do this myself. I’ve forgotten so so many books over the years that I supposedly read. Read How to Read a Book: The Classic Guide to Intelligent Reading by Mortimer Adler. ( https://www.amazon.com/How-Read-Book-Classic-Intelligent/dp/... ) I’ve given this book to a bunch of people on my teams as it also helps with communicating id…

> One big big big thing I learned from the book is to not read a non-fiction book like it was a novel. Do you mean to say: "is to read a non-fiction book like it was a novel"?

No, the comment was suggesting to not read a non-fiction book like a novel.

When reading a novel, you wouldn't skim it and skip ahead to find out all the plot twists and surprise ending and spoil all the suspense and fun.

With a nonfiction book, you're not worried about plot spoilers. You want to learn from the book. So skimming through it to pick up some of the gist before reading it in detail is a fine idea.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#54

Post by axiom92 » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:05 PM UTC

Stratoscope wrote: post #53

axiom92 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One big big big thing I learned from the book is to not read a non-fiction book like it was a novel. Do you mean to say: "is to read a non-fiction book like it was a novel"?

No, the comment was suggesting to not read a non-fiction book like a novel. When reading a novel, you wouldn't skim it and skip ahead to find out all the plot twists and surprise ending and spoil all the suspense and fun. With a nonfiction book, you're not worried about plot spoilers. You want to learn from the book. So skimming through it to pick up some of the gist before reading it in detail is a fine idea.

Oh ok! I skip through long-winded details in the novels all the time, hence the confusion. Thanks for the clarification!

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#55

Post by mkagenius » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:06 PM UTC

Elof wrote: post #29

stingraycharles wrote: post #9

I feel like I’m an outlier here on HN, but I read very slowly. My mind constantly switches back and forth between other stuff, and frequently have to repeat (sections of) a page just because I wasn’t paying enough attention. Needless to say, I don’t read a lot. Once in a while I find a book that interests me, and usually it takes me around a week or two to complete (when reading around 30 - 60 minutes a day).

Have you every tried listening to content. I’m adhd and dyslexic and have found that I retain content I listen to far far better than sight reading.

Listening is definitely better, but your mind will start to wander if you get bored. You have to forcefully do something to get back your attention.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#56

Post by guidoism » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:10 PM UTC

mattlondon wrote: post #49

Interesting... Lots of people seem to read a lot of books - I get lots of recommendations from people at work and stuff. People talk about reading a book a week or whatever. I've never enjoyed reading books - right from childhood up to now. I try to avoid it. I have gifts from birthdays and christmases from years ago where the book sits entirely unread on the shelf for a year or two until I give it away once the guil…

I'm curious about what it is about the format that you don't like. Or are you really just saying that you don't like the type of books that people give you?

I love consuming other types of media but they all have their place.

For fiction (especially SF) I love audiobooks — I listen to them for a couple of hours before I go to bed and while I was working I listened to them during my commute.

For non-fiction I hate audiobooks, unless it's narrative non-fiction like Bill Bryson. I really need the ability to quickly jump between parts of the book. If fact this is the reason why I hate the kindle for non-fiction too.

For math or something that is easier to understand with animations I prefer videos. YouTube is such an amazing resource for educational materials that it blow my mind that people still read textbooks for topics like Group Theory or Calculus. Interactive websites also work for math too.

For the social sciences I like regular hardback books. I like the ability to flip between pages, to have one finger holding one section open while looking at another. I love to serendipitously see something while skimming.

For anything current I prefer blogs. A book isn't going to be as relevant for something written about how some feature of Rust sucks and here are some alternatives.

To circle back, one feature a book has that a lot of other media don't is that they are put together very carefully and edited and are very thoughtful about how the information is presented. I'm sure Knuth has been a LOT of time deciding on the ordering and wording of his books.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#57

Post by mnemonicsloth » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:10 PM UTC

> once I finish a book I immediately replace it for the next one on my to-read list.

This right here is your problem. The way to really learn a book is to read it and then solve a lot of problems out of it, referring to it often. If it's a programming book (that's ideal), write programs that do what you read about. If it's a textbook there should be a lot of exercises for you to do. If there aren't any exercises you'll have to make up your own. That's a slow process, but it's still a more reliable route to deep understanding than reading superficially and never getting there.

That said, you remember more than you think you do. You may not recall everything you read, but a lot of that information is in your head somewhere, ready to act as foundation and building material if you ever visit the material again. You'd be amazed how much more you can get out of a book just by skimming it a second time, once you've got the big ideas.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#58

Post by mooreds » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:13 PM UTC

I used to write a review for my blog or Amazon (though they have horrendous ToS for reviews). Haven't done that for a long time though. But when I did it was nice:

* forced to review and outline major themes of the book, or at least why it was worth reading

* could go back and see what I thought about the book later

* helps other people, even if occasionally

My SO uses goodreads and enjoys both the ability to give a review and the score keeping nature of it.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#59

Post by axegon_ » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:14 PM UTC

Kind of depends on the book to be honest. For programming or tech-related textbooks, I make an extremely isolated and peaceful environment. Complete silence, phone on vibration, just plenty of water to drink at arms length and that's it. And my brain tends to be the most focused at night, which is helpful. But for all other books too: I tend to be a bit of a fanatic when it comes to peace and silence. I often end up reading 3-4 or 5 books at a given time, which is why it takes me multiple weeks to finish them as opposed to a day or two. I'll jump between all of them at random, forcing me to go back 15-20 pages each time. I have no idea why, this is how I've been reading since I was a child and never managed to get out of the habit. But with those I tend to be a bit more tolerant to external factors such as noise and other people so I can read just about anywhere with a tolerable amount of noise: buses, parks, planes, stations, airports and so on. I can't listen to any music while reading but I might resort to shoving a pair of earbuds in my ears for noise isolation without playing anything.

Re: Ask HN: How Do You Read?

#60

Post by thekyle » Sat, Aug 31, 2019, 7:15 PM UTC

mattlondon wrote: post #49

Interesting... Lots of people seem to read a lot of books - I get lots of recommendations from people at work and stuff. People talk about reading a book a week or whatever. I've never enjoyed reading books - right from childhood up to now. I try to avoid it. I have gifts from birthdays and christmases from years ago where the book sits entirely unread on the shelf for a year or two until I give it away once the guil…

Well you're not alone. I feel like I've never read a book that couldn't have been compressed down to an article and provided the same value (information dense books like textbooks excluded).

I do enjoy listening to audiobooks though. But that's more of something I do when I'm on an airplane or long car ride. That's what I always did in school when we had to "read" something.