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Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

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Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#51

Post by zmix »

benj111 wrote: post #35
Ididntdothis wrote: post #7

These used to be the ultimate symbol of “Spießertum”. Funny how things change and trends come and go.

"Spießertum" I'm getting the translation of philistine, which seems a bit harsh? Anything that better captures the flavour, for an Anglophone?

No, "philistine" is actually quite right. That's how Jesus Christ called them.

You could also call them submissive, hypocrite squareheaded cowards.

The "Spieß" seems to translate to "skewer", "spit", "pike". So, they sting, but are not very sharp. They always side with the authority du jour, because that keeps them safe.

Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#52

Post by ploubus »

kayoone wrote: post #44
benj111 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Spießertum" I'm getting the translation of philistine, which seems a bit harsh? Anything that better captures the flavour, for an Anglophone?

bourgeois is probably the right translation

Not quite. The Spießbürger is aggressively oriented towards rule-abiding behaviour and is always keen on enforcing said rules and regulations within it's environment. Also the Spießbürger finds rather creative ways to "persuade" others within his reach to abide by said rules and regulations.

Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#53

Post by C1sc0cat »

acomjean wrote: post #32
sandworm101 wrote: post #26

I used to think of gardening and allotments as a rather innocuous activity, something rather green that was good for all involved. But in the last year I've come to realize that it isn't environmentally sound. (1) Plastics and pesticides. They are over-used by gardeners as opposed to commercial farmers. Even without chemicals, the plastics pots, bags and other devices all end up in landfills. Those innocuous black po…

I think you under-estimate the pesticide regimen comerical farms use (I doubt your neighborhood gardener could get there hands on some of them). Though you are probably correct, small gardens aren't really an efficient way to grow food. I'm not a farmer but this description of farming from the end of last century stuck in my mind. https://www.nytimes.com/1998/10/25/magazine/playing-god-in-t... "I asked him to walk me…

Allotments became popular in ww2 as away of supplementing rations one of my Grandads in Birmingham (UK) used to keep chickens as in his back garden, as well as the odd bit of poaching (as he was a lad from the black country).

Wonder if I ought to put my name down for one in case Brexit really goes bad, unfortunately I didn't inherit his poachers shotgun (just as well as it is highly naughty in terms of uk firearms laws :-)

Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#54

Post by Ididntdothis »

benj111 wrote: post #35
Ididntdothis wrote: post #7

These used to be the ultimate symbol of “Spießertum”. Funny how things change and trends come and go.

"Spießertum" I'm getting the translation of philistine, which seems a bit harsh? Anything that better captures the flavour, for an Anglophone?

When I posted I thought about a translation but drew a blank. It’s somewhere between conservative, law abiding, rules oriented but also community oriented. But everybody has their own connotations so there is no real definition. Generally it’s used a derogatory term. Nobody calls themself a Spießbürger.

Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#55

Post by Ilverin »

sandworm101 wrote: post #26

I used to think of gardening and allotments as a rather innocuous activity, something rather green that was good for all involved. But in the last year I've come to realize that it isn't environmentally sound. (1) Plastics and pesticides. They are over-used by gardeners as opposed to commercial farmers. Even without chemicals, the plastics pots, bags and other devices all end up in landfills. Those innocuous black po…

Storing plastic in landfills is a form of carbon capture. The environmental cost is in transporting pieces of plastic around (added weight means more fuel use).

Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#56

Post by yorwba »

jbeales wrote: post #50
yorwba wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's unlikely you'll be able to find a ready-made translation for free, since it's very niche. Gesetze-im-Internet has translations of the more important laws, but for the Bundeskleingartengesetz there's only the German version: https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/bkleingg/BJNR002100983.ht... If you want a translation (to convince Montreal to adopt similar laws?) you'll need to find someone to translate it for…

Thanks for the link. I may be able to convince someone to translate if Google isn't good enough. If that page is the whole set of laws then it's really not so many rules as the article makes out - our rules in Montreal are probably just as long. I'm going to see if I can cherry-pick the best parts for my little corner of Montreal.

Well, that's the federal law. There are also additional regulations by the city of Berlin https://www.berlin.de/senuvk/umwelt/stadtgruen/kleingaerten/... and each local association has their own bylaws, e.g. for the borough of Charlottenburg: http://charlottenburger-kleingartenverband.de/pdf/Satzung%20...

Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#57

Post by Ididntdothis »

ploubus wrote: post #52
kayoone wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

bourgeois is probably the right translation

Not quite. The Spießbürger is aggressively oriented towards rule-abiding behaviour and is always keen on enforcing said rules and regulations within it's environment. Also the Spießbürger finds rather creative ways to "persuade" others within his reach to abide by said rules and regulations.

The funny thing is that a lot of the people who hate Spießbürgers like to impose rules and regulations on people and tell them what they are allowed to say or think.

Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#58

Post by umvi »

DragonCot wrote: post #17

As somebody who has done his time on a waiting list for an allotment, and has been allotmenteering for the past 7 years now, I find these small German allotments vastly different to our UK ones. I fly reasonably often to Munich and I've often seen them alongside the railway lines... and they are immaculate. But the bit I find odd is that there is an awful lot of grass. We in the UK tend to focus more on food or flowe…

> And maybe we ought to encourage more people to stop playing video games and get out and grow more stuff.

You can already do this in video games though (Harvest Moon, Stardew Valley, Farming Simulator, etc.)

Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#59

Post by jbeales »

yorwba wrote: post #56
jbeales wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the link. I may be able to convince someone to translate if Google isn't good enough. If that page is the whole set of laws then it's really not so many rules as the article makes out - our rules in Montreal are probably just as long. I'm going to see if I can cherry-pick the best parts for my little corner of Montreal.

Well, that's the federal law. There are also additional regulations by the city of Berlin https://www.berlin.de/senuvk/umwelt/stadtgruen/kleingaerten/... and each local association has their own bylaws, e.g. for the borough of Charlottenburg: http://charlottenburger-kleingartenverband.de/pdf/Satzung%20...

Excellent, thanks!

I Google Translated the federal law, and it seems to be mostly about how leases are dealt with. I also did some Googling and found what I think is the garden in the article, although there seems to be a few gardens in Wedding. They're big compared to what we have here in Montreal.

Re: Gardens with a 12,000-person waiting list

#60

Post by aphextim »

sandworm101 wrote: post #26

I used to think of gardening and allotments as a rather innocuous activity, something rather green that was good for all involved. But in the last year I've come to realize that it isn't environmentally sound. (1) Plastics and pesticides. They are over-used by gardeners as opposed to commercial farmers. Even without chemicals, the plastics pots, bags and other devices all end up in landfills. Those innocuous black po…

Here is my mini garden. No pesticides or plastics (other than plastic markers for the rows to be marked when they are seeds before they sprout, looking into this I could use a more bio degradable marker in the future).

All I do is water it when Nature doesn't provide enough, and weed it once a week for 30-35 minutes.

A little bit of corn, lettuce, peas, beans and onions to the left of the corn that you cannot see.

For just myself, this little bit of work keeps me with fresh lettuce all summer and not to mention beans/peas out of the garden are delicious!

I get where you are coming from regarding the factory/industrial farms who are more motivated with profits, however for the enthusiast or smaller mom and pop farms, there is nothing wrong with gardening and if anything should be encouraged so people are more able to be self reliant and break free from having to rely on the industrial farms.

https://imgur.com/a/j4wEooQ

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