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Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

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Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#461

Post by Phillips126 »

vortico wrote: post #453
Phillips126 wrote: post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also developed a website young (mid teens), which was essentially a "beautiful/unique website ranking" based on visitor submissions and upvote/downvote system. I had the essential pieces done and launched the website, super excited as my first real project. I decided to toss on Google AdSense to see if I could potentially monetize the website by putting a single picture advertisement on the right side of the websit…

How is this system immune to me clicking on an enemy website's ads 100's of times to get them banned from AdWords?

That was part of my argument during the appeal. And like every other report of similar things happening, all I get back in response was some canned copy/paste email from their policies. It seemed very out of my control for something like this to happen and I felt wrongly punished - and for a lifetime!? I can understand "banned for X amount of time" but as a young developer's first offence a lifetime ban seems a bit overkill.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#462

Post by CodeMage »

aurbano wrote: post #304

I ran a website that I first coded when I was 14-15, then kept improving over the years. It was for amateur electronic music producers to upload their tracks and after a few years there were several thousand active users, generating ~$400/month in AdSense. One day a relatively famous DJ tweeted a link to a song on the website, and that day alone generated close to $300, so 19 year old me thought he was about to earn…

Is there really no other way to monetize except through ads? Sure, there needs to be more regulation in this space, I agree with that. But the idea that ads are the best monetization has never sat well with me.

I understand that it's convenient because you get money without asking your end users for it. But I've always thought of it as "if it seems too good to be true, then it probably isn't" and stories like yours just keep reinforcing that feeling.

And all that's without considering how ads degrade the user experience or help erode the privacy. Every time I have to browse the web without an adblocker, I get freshly shocked at how awful it is.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#463

Post by ubermonkey »

edoo wrote: post #457
ubermonkey wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm highly technical -- 30 years in dev -- and I prefer the curated, controlled environment of iOS for my phone because I have zero interest in sysadmining my telephone. You put scare quotes around security, but Apple's approach really does result in a more stable and secure platform.

You are cherry picking. It might be more secure from drive by hackers but if any of Apples partners (NSA etc) want in you are carrying a big backdoor that by definition is devoid of security.

That's an "if", while Android is literally sponsored by a company that makes money on consumer surveillance, and apparently has a vibrant malware culture, so who's cherry picking again?

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#464

Post by rpmisms »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #105
javert wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the U.S., phone providers are protected by the government. You can't compete with them. The government has basically granted them fiefs. I feel like cars are great. I don't know where the complaint is there. There is an enormous amount of variety in cars. It's really amazing. Definitely a triumph of capitalism. I also don't really have a problem with banks. There seems to be plenty of options. People mostly just c…

> I feel like cars are great This is myopic, to put it lightly. Toyota own the three brands that are the least costly cars to maintain, followed by Honda. BMW’s cost, on average, three times as much to maintain.[1] I own a VW because I’m an enthusiast, but I drive a Honda because I also need a reliable vehicle. Some BMWs should be regulated out of existence . Rang Rovers too. I work directly opposite my mechanic and…

He wasn't talking about the cars, he was talking about the fact that BMW does not, in fact, have a monopoly. You can go buy a Toyota/Lexus instead.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#465

Post by RussianCow »

AnIdiotOnTheNet wrote: post #445
JohnBooty wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Windows wasn't like that. Yeah, and it was an absolute disaster. Until very recently (Win7, roughly, or perhaps Vista) near every Windows install -- unless it had been locked down by an administrator, or maintained by a power user -- was an absolute cesspool of malware and outright spyware. The average Windows machine was literally unsafe to use. That's fine for you to want it, but don't impose it on me. Essentially…

I'd rather have all software sandboxed by default. It's a much better solution than walled gardens or "blessed" packages.

The problem with this is that you'll always have exceptions, and eventually you have enough of them that users become accustomed to blindly hitting "Accept" to any permission dialogs.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#466

Post by segmondy »

vortico wrote: post #453
Phillips126 wrote: post #422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also developed a website young (mid teens), which was essentially a "beautiful/unique website ranking" based on visitor submissions and upvote/downvote system. I had the essential pieces done and launched the website, super excited as my first real project. I decided to toss on Google AdSense to see if I could potentially monetize the website by putting a single picture advertisement on the right side of the websit…

How is this system immune to me clicking on an enemy website's ads 100's of times to get them banned from AdWords?

Nothing. If anything, I'm feeling like we should create bots, browser extensions that repeatedly do this and cause massive havoc on their system until they listen and start figuring out better ways to fix their system. Folks are not fighting back. I'm not into ads and have never cared about using them to monetize, but if I did and they took my money. It's war.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#467

Post by olyjohn »

JohnBooty wrote: post #421
echelon wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't want to live in your locked-down Disney with the death sentence world. That's fine for you to want it, but don't impose it on me. I want freedom and liberty to do what I want with the devices I own. I want to develop without fear that these two megacorps can shut me down on a whim for developing something against their ideology. The web isn't like that. Windows wasn't like that. Today we live in a Fischer-Pri…

Windows wasn't like that. Yeah, and it was an absolute disaster. Until very recently (Win7, roughly, or perhaps Vista) near every Windows install -- unless it had been locked down by an administrator, or maintained by a power user -- was an absolute cesspool of malware and outright spyware. The average Windows machine was literally unsafe to use. That's fine for you to want it, but don't impose it on me. Essentially…

Windows wasn't unsafe to use, Internet Explorer and Outlook Express were unsafe to use. It had nothing to do with a lack of app stores, and more to do with the fact that ActiveX controls were allowed to run rampant on a machine, and that they could install themselves with a single dialog box that nobody ever paid attention to, and sometimes even bypass that.

I mean, even with an App Store, IE would have been pushed hard, just like Edge is now. And it still would have been a buggy mess, and people would have still been infected...

I can't believe I just defended Windows here...

I fixed hundreds, maybe thousands of machines infected with malware back in those days. Switching users to Firefox and a safe e-mail client nearly eliminated all of their issues.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#468

Post by mindslight »

ericmay wrote: post #180
oblio wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could just not void the warranty (more or less) for installing apps from other sources. Your mom always uses the App Store, everybody else is happy.

Which sounds fine until your mom hears about this cool App Store from her friend on Facebook, downloads a bunch of crap, and winds up at the Apple Store with Apple having to fix damage caused to her phone. I’m a little less sympathetic with the repairability stuff, but when it comes to the App Store, daddy Apple is doing a job that I want them to do, and changes here are not to my benefit and would make me less likel…

> winds up at the Apple Store with Apple having to fix damage

What is this nebulous "damage"? If an app escapes the sandbox and totally hoses the operating system, the fix should be basically plugging the phone into a cable at home and waiting say 24 hours to prevent evil maid attacks. If the malicious app manages go further and screw up the "hardware", then that implies a serious security vulnerability and so should be covered under warranty.

A security model based around every bit of code on a device being vetted is fundamentally unscalable. The cracks are really starting to show, with increasing false positives and false negatives.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#469

Post by NicoJuicy »

throwaway_law wrote: post #319
GhettoMaestro wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your ideal state of Internet / Tech companies is definitely in the minority contrasted to overall expectations the broader population has put on these devices and services. Yeah, we get it, you're smart. I'm smart. Most people here are smart. But protections still matter. What you're saying is I don't want to wear a seatbelt when driving my car. Sure that is your choice - but I think it is a very foolish one.

>What you're saying is I don't want to wear a seatbelt when driving my car. As others have said there may be more apt analogies...sticking with the car theme, it may be closer to a market where you buy a Ford and then you can only fill your Ford up with Ford gas from a Ford gas station. That market doesn't exist for clear cut reasons, but if it did you can bet Ford and other car manufacturers would claim the same thi…

I think it's more like: where do you want to go to copy your car keys.

You give complete access to a licensed dealer, that can be trialed, if abused.

Or you go to Brasil to pay 1/10th of the price and give them a copy of your password and address.

Something like that

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#470

Post by grawprog »

tylerl wrote: post #369
echelon wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't want to live in your locked-down Disney with the death sentence world. That's fine for you to want it, but don't impose it on me. I want freedom and liberty to do what I want with the devices I own. I want to develop without fear that these two megacorps can shut me down on a whim for developing something against their ideology. The web isn't like that. Windows wasn't like that. Today we live in a Fischer-Pri…

Fine. You don't have to. Android trivially lets you sideload apps downloaded from anywhere on the internet you wish. Apple not so much, but that's Apple. The vast majority of customers want an app store with tighter controls, and both Google and Apple provide it. There are a hell of a lot more complaints about these app stores not being locked down enough than those in your camp saying that they don't want it locked…

>The vast majority of customers want an app store with tighter controls,

Most people I've talked to don't even realize you can allow apps to be sideloaded on android. Most people don't even really look at their settings menu other than to change backgrounds and stuff.

I mean, at least on the latest phone I bought, I had to go to the build number, tap on it a bunch of times to get to the developer options, scroll down through a bunch of options that likely look terrifying to the average user until I found the option allow apps from outside sources.

When I tell people they can do this, or I tell them about f-droid or show them things on there, they tend to be kind of shocked that you can do that and usually want me to teach them how.

I've noticed a lot of people for the most part are kind.of scared to really dig into their devices without being told it's ok, but as soon as they know it's not going to destroy everything, they usually start trying to dig deeper.

The easy walled garden approach I find really stops people from wanting to learn more about what their devices can do and gives kind of a false sense of security, there's plenty of garbage and unsafe stuff in app stores and honestly, I use almost as much diligence downloading from there as I do from random places on the internet. A lot of people don't read reviews or bother even looking at permissions before the get something from the store and end up filling their phones with garbage anyway.

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