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Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

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Re: Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really get what you find disrespectful. Religious people generally believe that death is just a transition into a different plane. Why shouldn't a religious person be able to represent this in a comment? For the record, I read the note, and there's nothing in it that would make it inappropriate to leave a comment like "hope he is happy now" or whatever. Even if he asked people not to say this about his death,…

Comments that set me off were ones such as "May God have mercy on his soul." and "I am sorry. Please forgive me. Maybe then you can forgive yourself." Even the general "Lord, let your loving kindness be upon him; you came to us first, knowing we could not reach you on our own." seems more religious than consolatory, which bugged me as I got the impression from the note that religion was the facade his family and his…

It's likely that many commenters on sites like Gizmodo or Huff Post read the summary and skimmed the note, and left a "generic suicide consolation". That's my guess anyway.

That has little to do with the religiosity of those people, I think, it mainly just has to do with a group of people that has very little prudence about speech in general. You shouldn't set your standards too high for the unwashed; Hacker News is anathema to people that don't read, as just about everything here is wall-of-text; no funny cat pictures or YouTube memes to attract the less attentive crowd, and generally no stupid political nit-picking, or anything non-business or non-compsci.

Huffington Post is a content farm, essentially, and is filled with lots of distractions. It is also a home base for ideologues, with its founders and editors frequently appearing on talk shows and injecting themselves into political commentary. Much of its readership happens to be religious or Christian, just as most people you meet in the West will happen to be religious and/or Christian. Perhaps we should consider that though many of these people are leaving religiously-oriented comments, the propriety of their writing is not necessarily correlated with their religiosity so much as its correlated with other factors.

Re: Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

#52
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

implying that religions are themselves I take issue with even that much of the concept. Religions are not entities, only the people that make them up are. And it seems the unfortunately vast majority of the time, those people are hateful, ignorant, or just plain dulled.

Religions are not entities, only the people that make them up are. I could have phrased what I said better, but I stand by the essential meaning of what I said, and I disagree with you. A "religion" as a particular body of ideas, is distinct from the adherents to that religion. Which is why it's perfectly reasonable to say something like, "Most Christians don't actually live up to the teachings of Christianity." For…

These religions are often much more different than their common manifestations, but their peddlers simplify and adulterate the teachings to make them more palatable. It involves serious work to become either a real Christian or a real Muslim, and people prefer "drive-through religion", as it were.

I suggest you explore religion, especially religion that exists outside of the spotlight, more deeply to gain an appropriate understanding of how these things work.

For instance, religion does not emphasize faith over reason, but faith in tandem with reason; faith on a basic level is merely sufficient trust to give something an earnest try (or, in more religious terms, "things hoped for but not seen", which is to say, a belief in potential), which is a principle necessary in the acquisition of all meaningful knowledge.

Re: Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

#53
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Religions are not entities, only the people that make them up are. I could have phrased what I said better, but I stand by the essential meaning of what I said, and I disagree with you. A "religion" as a particular body of ideas, is distinct from the adherents to that religion. Which is why it's perfectly reasonable to say something like, "Most Christians don't actually live up to the teachings of Christianity." For…

These religions are often much more different than their common manifestations, but their peddlers simplify and adulterate the teachings to make them more palatable. It involves serious work to become either a real Christian or a real Muslim, and people prefer "drive-through religion", as it were. I suggest you explore religion, especially religion that exists outside of the spotlight, more deeply to gain an appropri…

faith in tandem with reason

That's a contradiction.

faith.. is necessary in the acquisition of all meaningful knowledge.

I strongly disagree.

Believe me, I've looked into it.

Re: Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

#54
post #32

You don't solve a problem by running away from it. This guy would have been very useful. He just needed counselling, attention and love to overcome the 'darkness and his ghosts'. But I don't think he was smart. He might have been clever in class and books but smart and brilliant people don't take their own lives. Brilliant is misused here. Anyway R.I.P.

Really? Who are you to tell someone he just needs 'counseling, attention and love'? I can tell you from personal experience counseling, attention, and love can very much be not only unproductive, but can easily make things worse. It's tiring to hear people say that the aftermath of event's that mark you like this, such as being raped, witnessing murder, physical abuse and torture, killing (be it a person from an enemy army or protecting your family), are solved by:

- Going into counseling, as sometimes it's just not enough. - Getting attention, as it's a distraction that can sometimes make falling back into the 'darkness' more painful. - Love, as more times than not it's easy to not be able to let go of the pain and transmit it to your loved ones and hurt them because of it.

It's easy to judge other people when you're living a sheltered life and you have some delusions of grandeur about how people with X and Y attributes should behave in a certain way that has been lodged in the back of your mind because of your upbringing or religion. The fact that you can so easily say that smart and brilliant people don't take their lives is a clear indicator that you really don't have a grasp on what being smart or brilliant is, but more important than that, it clearly shows that you have not had to go through anything as traumatizing as what this man went through.

In reality when you've gone through traumatizing events such as this, there is only one thing that will define if you're suicidal or not, and it's if you are strong enough to live with yourself, your 'darkness', and knowing someone else is either alive and unpunished, or suffered an undeserved and painful death.

I've seen stuff you could get out of a Saw movie, and sadly had to live a violent episode defending my home and loved ones (despite a middle-upper class upbringing, I did end up living on the crappiest and violent part of town on a small room with 2 other persons sharing a bed). Because of what I've lived I can tell you three things: smart/brilliant people take their lives because they can't deal with the feelings, not because they're actually dumb by some morality troll's standards; things like this mark you for life, and no amount of counseling can turn you back into someone you once where, though that doesn't mean that you can't live with the events or your decisions (In my case it gave me the most untrusting and uncaring character, which is something that affects every relationship I've had, romantic or otherwise); and people that act judgmental regarding things like this are doing so because they have this grand ego which gets fed by making others feel like they're beneath them. No one who has ever had to go through something as traumatizing as this would have the the heart (or the balls) to say the bullshit you've said.

Be more respectful and stop letting your nonsense morals talk crap of other people that deserve at least the silence of the witch-hunt people holding the pitchforks.

Re: Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

#56
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it's quoting a comment from Anil Dash. (More of the comment is quoted in the body of the article.)

That may be true, however there is still quite a disconnect between the intended "quoting" and resulting 'scare quote' issue. Basically, without knowing the quote, it adds a pile of sarcasm to the title roughly equivalent to: so-called smart guy kills himself It's just sad.

Not necessarily. Try reading " 'brilliant' " as " described by his colleagues as 'brilliant' ", take into account the well respected people that he worked with and its a far higher compliment than the article writer, who is almost certainly not a programmer, could possibly offer.

Re: Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

#57
post #32

You don't solve a problem by running away from it. This guy would have been very useful. He just needed counselling, attention and love to overcome the 'darkness and his ghosts'. But I don't think he was smart. He might have been clever in class and books but smart and brilliant people don't take their own lives. Brilliant is misused here. Anyway R.I.P.

Way to go HN. Instant downvote due to violent disagreement with an unpopular sentiment, not because the poster failed to add anything to the discussion.

I don't think it's a failure to contribute to point out that rational people( and here we would presume that brilliant programmers are generally rational )would conduct their lives and solve their problems rationally.

Physical trauma that occurred and ended 20 years ago is not the kind of thing a rational mind would choose suicide as a solution to.

I understand that the "feelings first" zeitgeist of modern America makes this kind of thinking unpopular, but for some reason I thought unpopularity alone was not considered an appropriate rubric to downvote on HN.

Re: Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

#58
post #32

You don't solve a problem by running away from it. This guy would have been very useful. He just needed counselling, attention and love to overcome the 'darkness and his ghosts'. But I don't think he was smart. He might have been clever in class and books but smart and brilliant people don't take their own lives. Brilliant is misused here. Anyway R.I.P.

I really don't understand the respect to this particular comment. I think kwoks expressed himself slightly awkwardly, but are the downvoters suggesting that this guy did the smart thing by taking his own life?

Re: Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

#59
I've been pushing this idea: "A half-way house for suicidal people" Basically, if you're intending to commit suicide, you simply register for the project, and you get an all-expenses paid trip to Iraq, Afghanistan or Congo or some other really dangerous place. Spend two to three months helping people out, then feel free to commit suicide after that.

No counseling, no attempt to talk you out of it, just a chance to be somewhere that will put you within a new world.

Re: Princeton Grad Student And 'Brilliant' Programmer, Dies In Apparent Suicide

#60
one must probably understand while reading this that the mental abuse was in his life constant,

tried to get rid of it, go to school etc. , but had to communicate with his family and probably that nullified his self-help totally every time.

Its probably something like working like mad on some programming project for a year and then someone hacks your system and deletes everything... after that one year to restore the system and then someone again comes and deletes it ..one more year to restore , and back to zero again

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