Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years • Hacker News Board

Re: Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years

#311

Post by mumblemumble » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 12:34 PM UTC

Mikeb85 wrote: post #275

okmokmz wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>many vegans are very price sensitive, not to mention have a disproportionate amount of other dietary restrictions Price sensitive as in not willing to pay as much as traditional customers? In my experience vegans tend to pay more for their food, as many of them look for local produce, fair trade, organic, etc. which drives the price up. I'd also be curious to learn what other dietary restrictions they may have. Asid…

The average amount spent per person in our restaurant is over $100. Never seen a vegan restaurant at that price point. Have had vegans complain that a $15 cauliflower appetizer is too expensive however. Edit - vegans also tend to restrict their diets further such as raw vegans, 'whole' food vegans, oil avoidance is a thing in the community, as is gluten free.

They're not super common, naturally. The first one that comes to mind is Candle 79 in NYC, which I think is at about that price point. Maybe a little below, but I wouldn't be surprised if a vegetarian restaurant of a certain caliber is going to come out at a slightly lower price point due to lower ingredient cost.

Re: Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years

#312

Post by nicoburns » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 3:12 PM UTC

Iv wrote: post #292

nicoburns wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is just not practical for me to go full-veg, where I live I would need to cook one hour a day for it, Why does eating meat mean you can cook less?

Because then I can buy pre-cooked food. I live in countryside Japan where it does not cost a lot more to buy a bento than to cook one yourself. Before moving in, I used to think it should be easy to be vegetarian in a Buddhist country but it is not. Japan's culinary habit is that a good meal needs to have a lot of different ingredients in it. From a dietetics point of view, that's great but it often means that even i…

Ah, interesting. Here in the UK, pre-made vegetarian food is readily available in both restaurants and supermarkets.

Re: Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years

#313

Post by Mikeb85 » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 3:18 PM UTC

mumblemumble wrote: post #311

Mikeb85 wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The average amount spent per person in our restaurant is over $100. Never seen a vegan restaurant at that price point. Have had vegans complain that a $15 cauliflower appetizer is too expensive however. Edit - vegans also tend to restrict their diets further such as raw vegans, 'whole' food vegans, oil avoidance is a thing in the community, as is gluten free.

They're not super common, naturally. The first one that comes to mind is Candle 79 in NYC, which I think is at about that price point. Maybe a little below, but I wouldn't be surprised if a vegetarian restaurant of a certain caliber is going to come out at a slightly lower price point due to lower ingredient cost.

> The first one that comes to mind is Candle 79 in NYC, which I think is at about that price point.

Nah, it's significantly lower if you consider that booze sales are ~30-40% of sales in most sit-down restaurants. When main courses are $25, typical guest check averages are more like $40-60.

> I wouldn't be surprised if a vegetarian restaurant of a certain caliber is going to come out at a slightly lower price point due to lower ingredient cost

Unfortunately labour and rent cost the same no matter what you serve.

Re: Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years

#314

Post by EForEndeavour » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:05 PM UTC

coldpie wrote: post #130

gwbas1c wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My stomach, ect, feel better when I eat less meat. But: I rarely order vegan in a restaurant. I find it's much easier to do vegan at home. Why? Mostly food safety and storage. After cooking vegan for a few weeks, when I cooked meat, I realized just how much of a pain in the *$$ maintaining food safety is.

> ect I keep seeing this. Where are people picking this up from?

Simple: incorrect attempts to spell "etc." annoy you, so you remember them unusually strongly.

Re: Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years

#315

Post by jonfw » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 4:41 PM UTC

rhn_mk1 wrote: post #277

jonfw wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because I don't think it's unethical to produce life in that circumstance, doesn't mean that I think it's your ethical imperative to produce life. Things don't go immediately from unethical to a moral imperative, there is a substantial gap that needs to be crossed.

> Things don't go immediately from unethical to a moral imperative, there is a substantial gap that needs to be crossed. I would accept that in the general case, but since you let your utilitarian views slip, I have to ask: what's the difference? When something is immoral, it means it has a negative utility, and therefore it should be avoided. When something is moral, it has a positive utility, and therefore it's som…

> barring any other activity with greater utility

I can think of a number of activities that would provide greater utility than attemting to impregnate as many women as possible.

I'm not a pure utilitarian and I see a distinction between the concepts of morality and utility. Mostly because I'm not capable of gauging utility all the time, so I can fall back on broader moral principles.

Re: Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years

#316

Post by dorchadas » Thu, Aug 29, 2019, 11:43 PM UTC

mattl wrote: post #122

dorchadas wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm doing the semi-veg lifestyle. Trying to avoid meat more days than not. It was totally environmentally based for me. I want to transition to full veg, but need to work on my prepping skills and planning better.

Is semi-veg, semi-vegetarian or semi-vegan?

Vegetarian for me.

Re: Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years

#317

Post by Iv » Fri, Aug 30, 2019, 9:25 AM UTC

roenxi wrote: post #299

Iv wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood that logic. I don't see why more animals (or humans) existing ought to be considered a good thing?

That isn't the core of the argument; the point is that there is no good outcome for most of those animals. The choice is exist, live and be slaughtered for food vs. never being born. Not an enviable choice, but it confounds some of the simple ethical arguments for, eg, vegetarianism.

But I don't understand how it is relevant to what we should do?

Our goal is to minimize the amount of suffering we are responsible of. In that respect it is obviously better to not breed animals than to breed them and make them suffer.

Re: Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years

#318

Post by ultim8k » Fri, Aug 30, 2019, 2:17 PM UTC

geddy wrote: post #194

ultim8k wrote: post #31

Too bad that vegan food is mostly carbs and tasteless stuff like tofu. There are so many tasty and healthy vegetables and great veggie recipes but you have to cook at home because you can't find them outside.

Those "mostly carbs" you're referring to include a ton of fiber, which is something the diehard meat eaters desperately lack in their diet. And the "tasteless stuff like tofu" does as much to demonstrate your lack of knowledge on the subject of veganism entirely, as well as the fact that you've never eaten well-prepared tofu.

Well, I'm on a carb-free diet right now and believe it or not, my food is full of vegetables and greens. The only kinda tasty tofu I had was full of sause (sugars and oils), or fried. I don't think either of them is healthy. My conclusion is that if you want to eat healthy the only option is to cook your own food.

Re: Vegan takeaway orders quadruple over past two years

#319

Post by _bfhp » Thu, Sep 05, 2019, 1:52 AM UTC

Iv wrote: post #294

_bfhp wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find the ethical-philosophical side of it interesting. In the philosophy of ethics, thought experiments can be helpful (or puzzling), like the trolley problem or the Categorical Imperative. So: Imagine if a wizard finished casting a very complicated and resource-intensive spell and the result is that every living cow, pig, chicken and turkey in the meat industry were replaced with a clone of a dog you've met. In th…

Wouldn't work on me, I have close to a hatred toward dogs :-) But I grew up in the countryside, I knew some cows and goats, heard the sad cry of the cows when you take their calves away. The reason why I eat very little beef and pork now but have less problems with chicken and fish is because I do feel different about them. See I used to be more concerned about the ethics of animal exploitation as a kid than as an ad…

Always grateful for someone sharing their experience. I think by "knew" I meant live with, as one would live with a pet dog or a cat. I see them every day, I get to know their personality at a level that I understand when they're suffering, and how much they understand doesn't matter to me. I would feel devastated if someone were to take them away from me and unfeelingly exploit them. I'm not vegan, but I guess I'm boohooing participant.