Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

medium.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

381–390 of 607 posts

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#381

Post by dx034 »

foepys wrote: post #64
robk wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they wait until a payout to do a deeper analysis. Most sites that sign up are spam and fraud that never earn much. So a payout threshold is a natural way of gating the spending of resources to weed out fraud and junk.

Until then they are happy to get paid by advertisers to show ads on spam sites?

Payout thresholds for Adsense are quite low. But it's right, in these cases they'd have to reimburse the advertisers. They could keep their share for investigation and running the ads but at least the amount that was due to be paid out should be reimbursed.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#382

Post by mirimir »

badrequest wrote: post #361
mirimir wrote: post #210

The Google and Apple app stores and support services ought to be regulated as public utilities. Because they effectively constitute a duopoly regarding apps for mobile devices. That would prevent them from arbitrarily refusing to provide services and list apps in their stores. They could refuse, but only for permitted reasons, and with a clear appeal process. The Public Utility Commission of Texas has a pretty clear…

I don't know if I agree that mobile apps are on the same level as electricity and internet connectivity in terms of how crucial they are to be productive citizenry.

For app developers, they certainly are.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#383

Post by sireat »

techntoke wrote: post #5
dollar wrote: post #3

The easiest way to identify a monopoly is to look at how badly a company can treat its customers and still get away with it. My company has a half dozen stories like this about Google in the last year alone. Know what Google is doing to its AdSense partners on a massive scale? They wait until your site has just under the earnings when they have to write you a check, then they terminate your AdSense account for “polic…

I would want any company that is abusing their power to face consequences. However, it wouldn't surprise me one bit to find out that some of these companies complaining about getting banned are legitimately doing something wrong and their only cards to play are hoping for a political reaction, rather than suing Google in court and being exposed for why they were actually banned.

The problem isn't Google punishing actors they deem "bad".

Many of the banned probably did something most of us (and they) deem "shady".

The problem is Google's complete lack of transparency and super reliance on automation.

Google's defense is that they do not want to give out even one bit of information so theoretically some bad actors could assemble a composite model on how Google banning algorithm works.

Ok, but how about giving some sort of reasonable response and some sort of reasonable appeals process?

We are rapidly heading to "Computer's Don't Argue" society: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computers_Don%27t_Argue

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#384

Post by zaroth »

johneth wrote: post #374
zaroth wrote: post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Google and Apple App Stores generate ~$100 billion in annual revenue combined, and growing at about 25% per year. The App Stores are the greatest software distribution and monetization platforms ever created, second perhaps only to “The Internet” as a whole. Regulating the App Stores as some sort of utility sounds like the perfect way to stifle growth and make it more difficult and expensive to publish on the App…

> Regulating the App Stores as some sort of utility sounds like the perfect way to stifle growth and make it more difficult and expensive to publish on the App Store Please explain how you've come to this conclusion, because I can't follow your logic.

It’s well established that regulations increase transaction costs and stifle innovation.

Take FDA regulations for example. The cost of developing a drug for sale in the USA in orders of magnitude higher due to these regulations. In safety critical systems, we pay this cost because the alternative is that people die. However, even still, the regulatory system itself may also be responsible for many deaths, due to viable treatments being either unavailable or unaffordable.

A regulatory framework on software distribution platforms frankly sounds horrific on many levels, but to avoid hyperbole, the most obvious effect would be increased compliance cost to the platform provider, which would be passed on to developers or end users.

Making apps unreviewable, or prohibitively costly to review, or imposing significant liability into the app review process is a recipe for increased cost and decreased growth, simply put.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#385

Post by samirm »

Havoc wrote: post #56
StanAngeloff wrote: post #53

We were banned from the Play Store for violation of their Impersonation policy in mid July after publishing an update. We just got reinstated last week. During the course of the lengthy appeal I had an unshakable feeling I was up against The System™. I still believe I was communicating with a bot and not an actual human being — I refuse to accept a rational human being will behave the way Bob from Google did. It's su…

>When did thing go so horribly wrong? When every company and their dog decided their content needs an app. Instead of using the nicely standardized thing called http and web browsers. That moved us from http straight to corporate technical fiefdoms with no control.

> nicely standardized thing called http and web browsers

hah, good joke.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#386

Post by tedivm »

dollar wrote: post #3

The easiest way to identify a monopoly is to look at how badly a company can treat its customers and still get away with it. My company has a half dozen stories like this about Google in the last year alone. Know what Google is doing to its AdSense partners on a massive scale? They wait until your site has just under the earnings when they have to write you a check, then they terminate your AdSense account for “polic…

This adsense behavior isn't even new- they did this to me in 2005! My website had a trickle of ads, just enough to pay for my college books each year. When I went to cash out Google decided it was click fraud and stole my money, with absolutely no recourse.

They're an awful company with horrible customer support. It's frustrating too, because my startup has investors who keep trying to get us to switch to GCP, but I don't think any responsible company would ever make themselves dependent on Google.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#387

Post by oarsinsync »

mcguire wrote: post #380
zaroth wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you fundamentally believe the government should force Apple to provide its software and services under very specific terms of use. You understand that many of these APIs are actually cloud-backed services that cost Apple money to operate? You understand that Apple funds the development and operation of these services through their share of App Store revenue? But you fundamentally believe this business model should…

Can we keep the discussion in good faith?

How do you manage battery life when multiple apps need to keep its own persistent connections open to its own home server for push notifications? How do you explain this to end users, when even tech-savvy people assume bad-faith when it's pointed out that many APIs are cloud-backed, forgetting the most obvious example of a cloud-backed API that is provided?

Or, how does the mobile OS vendor perform any kind of spam protection at all on push notifications if they have to open their notification gateways to absolutely anyone? (I'm not suggesting they're doing a great job of it now, but think about what happens when they lose the most effective stick - being kicked off the platform - that they have)

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#388

Post by earhart »

echelon wrote: post #242
laingc wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Personally, as an iOS user, I do not want the App Store opened up at all. Currently, I can go to the App Store, install any app, and be about 99.9% confident that the app will do me (or my technologically illiterate mother) absolutely no harm. This is something I value highly, and am happy to pay the “Apple premium” for.

I don't want to live in your locked-down Disney with the death sentence world. That's fine for you to want it, but don't impose it on me. I want freedom and liberty to do what I want with the devices I own. I want to develop without fear that these two megacorps can shut me down on a whim for developing something against their ideology. The web isn't like that. Windows wasn't like that. Today we live in a Fischer-Pri…

Software has security bugs, and enough people are evil that you will get burned with that approach. I’m a professional in this space, and I really can’t tell whether some random app is going to be evil or not; how is a non-techie supposed to figure it out?

The real problem is that Google’s been unable to either secure Android or prevent malicious apps from showing up even given their locked-down store.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#389

Post by WorldMaker »

iamsb wrote: post #72
dollar wrote: post #3

The easiest way to identify a monopoly is to look at how badly a company can treat its customers and still get away with it. My company has a half dozen stories like this about Google in the last year alone. Know what Google is doing to its AdSense partners on a massive scale? They wait until your site has just under the earnings when they have to write you a check, then they terminate your AdSense account for “polic…

I never been to silicon valley, so my knowledge about it is extremely limited. But last couple of years, I am hearing so many stories from big tech companies - from google to facebook to snapchat to uber - that I wonder if there is a big culture issue in valley based companies.

The way I've put it before, is that a culture issue (in something of a soup of them) is that "people" aren't an "interesting technology" that will, for instance, make HN headlines or provide interesting things for technologists to work on or brag about, so SV companies don't really invest in "people" to solve problems. SV companies under-value important labor roles like customer service, and instead over-value automation and algorithms.

A common argument is that people don't "scale" quite like automation and algorithms do, but we have millennia in expertise in labor markets (humanity survived quite a while without algorithms pretending to be customer service) that we could do much better, if so much of SV wasn't about avoiding and/or entirely shirking labor costs for "shinier" technology solutions.

Re: Google just deleted my nearly 10-year-old free and open-source Android app

#390

Post by GhettoMaestro »

cameronbrown wrote: post #294
GhettoMaestro wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your ideal state of Internet / Tech companies is definitely in the minority contrasted to overall expectations the broader population has put on these devices and services. Yeah, we get it, you're smart. I'm smart. Most people here are smart. But protections still matter. What you're saying is I don't want to wear a seatbelt when driving my car. Sure that is your choice - but I think it is a very foolish one.

There's no reason the App Store can't hang around, we just want the ability to sideload. Comparing it to not wearing a seatbelt is a straw man, as it's more like being able to use your car however you like without the manufacturer's say so.

I agree with your desire to side-load. My only caveat I would apply to that is to put some super really scary warnings to the user (as they will be no longer within the security of the walled ecosystem). I don't want users to accidentally side-load something because someone told them to, and not be aware of the extra risk the are potentially introducing.
Post reply on HN