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exFAT in the Linux kernel

cloudblogs.microsoft.com

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Re: exFAT in the Linux kernel

#131

Post by ses1984 »

chme wrote: post #114
ses1984 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a significant number of Linux users don't care about this.

That depends. If they are a Linux user because Linux runs on their server, router, mobile phone or what not. Then you are probably right. People that go through the trouble of installing Linux on a Desktop Machine, where Windows or MacOS was probably pre-installed, will either dual boot or use Linux exclusively. If they dual-boot, they will probably just use Office on the non-Linux System and not care. But if they us…

I still disagree. I used Linux almost exclusively because it made my job easier and I don't like switching between operating systems, and I use cloud services like Gmail and Dropbox. I also use the free version of onenote from ms. I just use whatever is convenient.

Then I switched jobs, they gave me a new MacBook that doesn't run Linux so I use osx.

Ten years ago I cared about privacy, now I feel like that ship has sailed. My own privacy is not that important. The privacy of my fellow citizens is gone. I mourn it kind of, but you can't close Pandora's box.

Re: exFAT in the Linux kernel

#132

Post by throwaway_391 »

viraptor wrote: post #126
throwaway_391 wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would recommend against using Office 365 web ui for word/excel etc, I'd also recommend avoiding the MacOS Office build for the same reason: They're both buggy as hell, the type of bugs that will make your document render in unintended ways when somebody opens it on the other side. At some point, Word for Mac decided to remove whitespace between words on my resume - I couldn't see them and generally exported to PDF,…

> I'd also recommend avoiding the MacOS Office build for the same reason I never understood why they made it a effectively a different product. (Once you go past the trivial interaction) Different features, different behaviours, different problems. Why is excel for Mac not the same engine with a different UI?

Probably likely to do with the toolkit used to build the Windows version and inability or unwillingness to port it to Mac.

They really need to start from scratch and build solid, easily testable product because the current methodology doesn't work.

I especially love the bugs where when in one specific track changes mode typing in the comments section drops keys, or when using 'read aloud' the voice randomly changes gender. Office 365 on a Windows 10 LTSC virtualised host w/ no other software.

Re: exFAT in the Linux kernel

#134

Post by immigrantsheep »

msftlvslicnsing wrote: post #96
GordonS wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that's pretty unfair - Microsoft has changed enormously in the past 5 years.

VSCode, exFat, and .Net core are not enormous. Their revenue streams are enormous and remain as close to their chest as ever.

So they should start losing money? Should Google? Should Apple? I don't get this argument. And .Net Core being open source is enormous if you use it.

Re: exFAT in the Linux kernel

#135

Post by incompatible »

jaboutboul wrote: post #71
mda wrote: post #64

So after abusing this bullshit for more than a decade to bully companies. How gracious and generous of them. Oh btw, Satya is the CEO for 5 years.

Stop shitting on them. We won the war. They’re mending their ways. It takes a long time to right such a large ship with levels upon levels of bureaucratic bullshit that’s been caked on for decades. It’s a WIP and they just granted a patent license to the OIN for fuck’s sake. Even 10 years ago this would have sounded like science fiction.

Didn't we just have a post complaining that the Microsoft Skype web client rejects Firefox, for no obvious reason? Yes, it was https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20818750.

Maybe their interests have just shifted higher on the protocol stack.

Re: exFAT in the Linux kernel

#136

Post by lern_too_spel »

swiley wrote: post #55
TwoNineA wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They already extorted Android OEMs using exFat patents for billions, might as well try to look nice.

As much as I hate the patent bullying Android should have never used FAT for ANYTHING . The stupidity around that continues to make everyone's lives hard to this day.

If you want an SD card that is also readable by the digital camera ecosystem, what choice do you have?

Re: exFAT in the Linux kernel

#137

Post by sjwright »

throwaway_391 wrote: post #117
pedrocr wrote: post #33

I'll believe Microsoft loves Linux when I can install Microsoft Office in my desktop Linux machine. Everything else is marketing. Edit: to expand, the corporate world runs on Excel/PowerPoint/Outlook. Microsoft milks them on Windows/Office licensing and is very aggressive against organizations that try to do Linux deployments. They're a convicted monopolist that got away easily when at some point the option on the ta…

I would recommend against using Office 365 web ui for word/excel etc, I'd also recommend avoiding the MacOS Office build for the same reason: They're both buggy as hell, the type of bugs that will make your document render in unintended ways when somebody opens it on the other side. At some point, Word for Mac decided to remove whitespace between words on my resume - I couldn't see them and generally exported to PDF,…

> I didn't hear back from prospective jobs that asked for a word format specifically

This almost always means you're speaking to a recruiter who is going to strip your identity from the resume so they can hold it hostage for an agreed commission. This also puts your submission at a disadvantage because you're automatically 10% more expensive than the next guy.

If you're submitting your job application, double check that you're submitting through the company's preferred channel. Look for the job on their own website. And be suspicious when they request an editable file format.

Re: exFAT in the Linux kernel

#138

Post by stevenjohns »

pedrocr wrote: post #33

I'll believe Microsoft loves Linux when I can install Microsoft Office in my desktop Linux machine. Everything else is marketing. Edit: to expand, the corporate world runs on Excel/PowerPoint/Outlook. Microsoft milks them on Windows/Office licensing and is very aggressive against organizations that try to do Linux deployments. They're a convicted monopolist that got away easily when at some point the option on the ta…

I would settle for just Skype for Business on Linux. No excuses why it shouldn't be on there... and yet it isn't.

Re: exFAT in the Linux kernel

#139

Post by xxs »

stevenjohns wrote: post #138
pedrocr wrote: post #33

I'll believe Microsoft loves Linux when I can install Microsoft Office in my desktop Linux machine. Everything else is marketing. Edit: to expand, the corporate world runs on Excel/PowerPoint/Outlook. Microsoft milks them on Windows/Office licensing and is very aggressive against organizations that try to do Linux deployments. They're a convicted monopolist that got away easily when at some point the option on the ta…

I would settle for just Skype for Business on Linux. No excuses why it shouldn't be on there... and yet it isn't.

Skype for Business has been replaced by teams which is not much better and pretty much still an awful chat application.

Re: exFAT in the Linux kernel

#140

Post by dylan-m »

saidajigumi wrote: post #48
elipsey wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, dumb question. :) I guess I never noticed a problem because either I mostly use ext3/4, or I am so used to using legally dubious drivers that I forgot they were there. I mean, who ever gives you a FAT formatted disk? I don't have floppy drive anyway :p

Cameras. High capacity removable flash media used by digital still and video cameras is often formatted as exFAT. Despite MS' licensing, FAT/FAT32/exFAT are essentially the "file systems of interchange" for removable flash media. More info at: https://fossbytes.com/fat32-vs-ntfs-vs-exfat-difference-thre...

This was also a huge problem for Android. At some point Android started using MTP instead of appearing as a mass storage device, which made for several technical wins. Most importantly, internal memory could be one contiguous block formatted as ext3. But this happened well before MTP was properly supported in Windows, which predictably made things difficult for a lot of users. (This was back when Android had competition, so that was important).

If I was a betting type, I'd wager that Microsoft's FAT patents (and various legal settlements where they got to say "Linux infringes on hundreds of patents" without ever needing to specify the patents) had a lot to do with that change, since, with the exception of a few manufacturers who continued to ship devices with external SD slots, and USB-OTG which is kind of a bonus feature, Android finally didn't need FAT for interoperability.

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