Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

ourworldindata.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

71–80 of 84 posts

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#71

Post by pvaldes »

liability wrote: post #67
pvaldes wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is a decission reserved to parents, in this case. Triage is a term that aim to save the maximum number of people in disasters with many victims. Not to decide if somebody dies or lives. People is classified in colors black, red, etc after its state. If you are in an accident and you cry and shout repeatedly you are classified in a lower priority than the quiet person that do not moves.

Between population growth not slowing anywhere near fast enough and rapid environment loss due to climate change, there is a good chance we'll see the mother of all triages. Not something to look forward to.

Yup, "lets kill the poor and all our problems will be solved" is a trendy old idea, trendy and deeply wrong also.

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#72

Post by UnFleshedOne »

xyzzyz wrote: post #49
roguecoder wrote: post #13

Leishmaniasis is a cool case: the drop in death is partially attributable to the orphaned drug process approving a drug that had been abandoned as unprofitable. When capitalism can't save lives, governments can.

The orphan drugs are unprofitable precisely because the government regulation require expensive certification before you can produce drugs. Thus, in this case, you’re praising government for solving (at least partly) a problem that the government created in the first place.

That's like saying "government is solving a problem it created" when government builds a water treatment plant so that a small community who can't afford one, can reach water quality levels mandated by the government. Yes, but...

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#73

Post by UnFleshedOne »

mrpopo wrote: post #65
lopmotr wrote: post #21

I have a pet theory that saving children from natural deaths is harmful to future generations. Surely by intervening so much, we're giving unhealthy people as much evolutionary advantage as healthy people. If the whole world reaches western standards of infant mortality and stays there long enough, will children eventually become dependent on even more interventions and be even more vulnerable to death without them?…

OP's position is a bit extreme, but I wanted to share this as it's somehow related: forced sterilization under Japanese Eugenic Protection Law. About 16,500 people, mostly women with disabilities, were targeted between 1948 and 1996 under a Japanese law that aimed to stop the birth of children described as “inferior”. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/18/victims-of-for...

Didn't UK and US have similar policies?

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#74

Post by UnFleshedOne »

lopmotr wrote: post #21

I have a pet theory that saving children from natural deaths is harmful to future generations. Surely by intervening so much, we're giving unhealthy people as much evolutionary advantage as healthy people. If the whole world reaches western standards of infant mortality and stays there long enough, will children eventually become dependent on even more interventions and be even more vulnerable to death without them?…

Humans are merely robots executing optimization process that benefits their genes chances of reproduction (and not for any explicit benefit to individuals themselves), but there is no reason we should go along with it. We have the tools to eventually break free.

If we ever lose access to technology, we'll die back to stone age anyway and only strongest and most ruthless will survive. What's a few more deaths because of genetic maladaptations as long as there is enough genetic diversity so some can survive and reproduce?

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#75

Post by pvaldes »

lopmotr wrote: post #21

I have a pet theory that saving children from natural deaths is harmful to future generations. Surely by intervening so much, we're giving unhealthy people as much evolutionary advantage as healthy people. If the whole world reaches western standards of infant mortality and stays there long enough, will children eventually become dependent on even more interventions and be even more vulnerable to death without them?…

Genetic diversity is a main factor for survival of any species, as long as your children are functional to reproduce is fine.

Is unhealthy to have blue eyes, 100% round erythrocites and white skin in Africa. You have a much higher risk of develop skin cancer or Malaria. Is also unhealthy to have black eyes, curly hair and black skin in Norway. You lose more heat and have problems with vitamin D absortion... but both traits suppose an advantage in different areas.

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#76

Post by lern_too_spel »

fortran77 wrote: post #69
lern_too_spel wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tunnel isn't to prevent suicides. It's to enable running six trains per hour. With the tracks at street grade as they are now, this causes traffic issues and increases the risk of train and car collision, which cause massive delays.

Nope. That and "property values" are the reason why the people of Palo Alto want it. Which is why it's relevant to the topic of "what can we spend money on to save lives." Here's a community of wealthy people most of whom will say they're for "social justice" who want to take billions of dollars of taxpayer money to _maybe_ save a few lives. https://padailypost.com/2018/06/02/tunnel-idea-is-still-aliv... > Councilman…

> Which is why it's relevant to the topic of "what can we spend money on to save lives."

The money is not being spent to save lives like you had originally claimed, so it is totally irrelevant to that topic. It is being spent to increase train frequency, which requires grade separation. The options for grade separation are building a tunnel or building overpasses. Within the context that one or the other option must be chosen, the options have pros and cons relative to each other, one minor point (brought up in passing by one city council member) of which is suicide prevention.

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#77

Post by fucking_tragedy »

gingabriska wrote: post #62
pvaldes wrote: post #52

From the chart, it seems obvious that the old strategy of hide HIV and sexual transmission diseases under the rug, to protect the rights of the carriers, is not working at all. At least not for protecting "collateral damage" children. Practically the Same children infected and killed by sexual transmission diseases in 2007 than in 1997. AIDS mortality has even increased. Same as 'iNTS' (what's this?) There is a lot o…

It's quite easy to solve actually. We can have an app where if you consent to have sex with someone then your sexual health status is automatically shared with whoever you consented to before the act. You only have sex once you get green light, otherwise you are on your own! Does it breach their right? IDK, I'll let someone HNer educate me on that. And if it's a solution then why isn't it being implemented, how can w…

People can already share their STD test results, and some clinics even make their patients' results available online so that they can be verified.

Technology isn't going to solve this sociological problem.

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#78

Post by squirrelicus »

jdietrich wrote: post #70
rjf72 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To emphasize the flaws of this argument, flip it around. You are effectively arguing that you can change the views, values, and beliefs of an entire nation by marketing. This doesn't sound so unreasonable when it's an 'us vs them' because it's easy to underestimate others. So instead let's make it a 'them vs us' argument. If what you're saying is accurate then similarly you ought be able to radically shift the views,…

>If what you're saying is accurate then similarly you ought be able to radically shift the views, values, and beliefs of America using marketing. If someone had the money and the motivation, I have no doubt that they could. There's reasonably compelling evidence that Russia is engaged in exactly that as we speak, albeit on a fairly modest budget. It's undoubtedly true that the USA has done so overseas; the CIA, the S…

> There's reasonably compelling evidence that Russia is engaged in exactly that as we speak.

I mean, not through marketing. Through exposing the DNC's treatment of Bernie, yes. But...I mean... Have you seen the Facebook ads they put out? It's possible they convinced more people to vote, but they didn't change any votes. It's stuff like "Jesus loves Trump and hates Hillary" level rhetoric.

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#79

Post by xyzzyz »

UnFleshedOne wrote: post #72
xyzzyz wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The orphan drugs are unprofitable precisely because the government regulation require expensive certification before you can produce drugs. Thus, in this case, you’re praising government for solving (at least partly) a problem that the government created in the first place.

That's like saying "government is solving a problem it created" when government builds a water treatment plant so that a small community who can't afford one, can reach water quality levels mandated by the government. Yes, but...

This would be an apt analogy if the small community was legally forbidden from using water the quality of which doesn't meet government standards. Yes, drinking low quality water is probably harmful, but not having anything to drink at all is significantly more harmful.

Re: What are children dying from and what can we do about it?

#80

Post by liability »

pvaldes wrote: post #71
liability wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Between population growth not slowing anywhere near fast enough and rapid environment loss due to climate change, there is a good chance we'll see the mother of all triages. Not something to look forward to.

Yup, "lets kill the poor and all our problems will be solved" is a trendy old idea, trendy and deeply wrong also.

I thought this discussion was about prioritizing care to children that have a chance at a normal life (e.g. are not "a blind, deaf and mentally retarded baby with a chronic heart condition"), not killing the poor. My bad.
Post reply on HN