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Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

nytimes.com

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Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#181

Post by paul7986 »

pb7 wrote: post #155
paul7986 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is this point being downvoted? It is not relevant to this discussion or it's something else??? Again It's well documented the big G steals IP!!

Because you're letting your emotions get the best of you.

You might too if the company who inspired you to dream and create tech invited you to demo and then treated you like a dog(possibly stole from u). I met with other names like Samsung, Intel, Black n Decker and no deal was made there too but I was treated respectfully with dignity!

I told my story for years here then last December lo and behold Ji Qie of MIT tells the same story I've told for awhile but with emails/evidence clearly showing Google getting caught stealing IP. She met with Google ATAP too!

Overall the narrative shouldn't be only about Anthony doing wrong rather he was mimicking what he witnessed and was taught (directly or indirectly) by his employer, Google to do; steal IP!

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#182

Post by javert »

walshemj wrote: post #176
javert wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I live in a poor country which is poor mostly because the established economic powers are able to strangle new centers of wealth creation in the cradle, using the government and laws. Don't let that happen in your country. Is there any country in the world that still prioritizes freedom over having a massive regulatory state? It would surprise me.

Compared to some countries the USA does ask any Engineer from India about relieving letters and bonds.

> relieving letters and bonds

I don't know what a relieving letter is and I only know of a bond as a debt instrument. Can you explain?

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#183

Post by mountainofdeath »

TuringNYC wrote: post #141
cletus wrote: post #53

The level of greed, hubris and stupidity of some people never ceases to amaze me. Levandowski was paid a bonus of $120 million while at Google, which is more money than any reasonable person will need for several lifetimes. This was actually a running joke at Google (while I was still there) to describe $120M as "1 Levadownski". Like Sundar one year was described as earning "only 1.7 Levadownskis" (he got paid $200M…

I don’t know details about his work at Google but it isn’t uncommon for people who have gotten caught criminally to have done plenty to push the envelope over the years, with actions going from ok, to aggressive, to sleazy, to unethical (but still legal), to unethical (possibly civil offenses), and eventually to criminal. It isn’t usually that someone turns overnight. Again, I don’t know details here but if you see p…

Yes. It's the reason why so many crimes are punished severely (e.g. think about how hard driving-under-the-influence is punished). If you did it enough to get caught, especially as part of an active investigation rather than being passively discovered, you probably did way more of it.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#184

Post by javert »

kragen wrote: post #67
javert wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I live in a poor country which is poor mostly because the established economic powers are able to strangle new centers of wealth creation in the cradle, using the government and laws. Don't let that happen in your country. Is there any country in the world that still prioritizes freedom over having a massive regulatory state? It would surprise me.

Governments do not prioritize the freedom of their subjects; it's contrary to the incentives of everyone in the government. People win freedom by limiting the powers governments have over them.

I know, but that doesn't answer my question. I'm not asking which government prioritizes freedom. I'm asking which country prioritizes freedom.

edit: also, could you explain why philosophy caused you to move around the world? You mention this on your web page ;)

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#185

Post by sangnoir »

tyingq wrote: post #40
asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The maximum penalty is 250k per count or twice the gross gain/loss, whichever is greater. So the financial penalty could be quite significant.

Wouldn't a conviction open him up to a more costly civil suit? Harder to defend a civil suit if you're guilty in a related criminal charge.

I doubt he's open to civil suit - at least from Google: both parties are bound by an arbitration agreement that preceded the Uber debacle.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#186

Post by greenyoda »

deleted_account wrote: post #118
oneepic wrote: post #68

Can someone explain the difference between this situation and the following situation: - engineer at Company A has expertise in a certain field, and is really, really good at solving problems in this field and knowing what to do next at any point in time. They bring quality to Company A's systems. - engineer moves to Company B to do the same kind of work, and uses their expertise to bring Company B's systems up to hi…

The indictment[1] sheds some light on the difference: "On or about December 11,2015, he downloaded approximately 14,000 files from SVN. These files contained critical engineering information about the hardware used on Project Chauffeur self-driving vehicles, including schematics for the printed circuit boards used in various custom LiDAR products." In other words, the accusation is that he stole technology that was t…

> In other words, the accusation is that he stole technology that was the output of the entire Project Chauffeur team, not simply stuff of his own creation.

Even "stuff of his own creation" that he created for Google while an employee there would be Google's intellectual property (assuming the usual terms of employment), and if he took it with him after leaving, it would still be theft.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#187

Post by onetimemanytime »

cletus wrote: post #53

The level of greed, hubris and stupidity of some people never ceases to amaze me. Levandowski was paid a bonus of $120 million while at Google, which is more money than any reasonable person will need for several lifetimes. This was actually a running joke at Google (while I was still there) to describe $120M as "1 Levadownski". Like Sundar one year was described as earning "only 1.7 Levadownskis" (he got paid $200M…

>>Levandowski was paid a bonus of $120 million while at Google, which is more money than any reasonable person will need for several lifetimes.

$120 Mil is about half after taxes. Or nothing, depending on the crowd Levandowski hang out with or wanted to join. Private jets, Aspen ranches etc etc cost a lot of money... IMO he felt he would get away with it and become a billionaire. Fame and billions might not let you enjoy your tens of millions.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#188

Post by magduf »

methehack wrote: post #50
uuilly wrote: post #14

I used to work for Anthony at 510 systems. He tried to hire me for Otto as well. Watching this whole thing unfold from, obscure story in 2011 to the Waymo Vs. Uber trial to federal charges and national news is rather surreal. Anthony is one of the most creative, energetic thinkers I've ever encountered. If he stopped taking shortcuts he'd probably be the next Jobs or Musk.

That's tragic and awful. I think calling this a "shortcut" though is misleading, at least from what the times is reporting here. It's one thing to own your own brain, it's another take 14K files, including circuit board designs and lidar designs. It's yet another to start using them at new-co that is a direct competitor to old-co. I'm by no means an IP fanatic, but that really does cross over to theft in my mind. But…

Taking PCB design files and using them at a competing company absolutely is IP theft. I'm honestly surprised anyone would think they could even get away with this; the old company just has to get their hands on one of the competitor's units and open it up and look at it.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#189

Post by xkcd-sucks »

kragen wrote: post #129
xkcd-sucks wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would it be wrong to claim that sales, investors, and lawyers now generate more value than engineers? The market seems to reflect this in salary allocation

As I explained in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20813333 , the division of spoils from a collective endeavor is largely a result of social norms and bargaining power, not disinterested justice.

Exactly -- The meme "generates more value" is morally bankrupt

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#190

Post by School-Cotton »

kragen wrote: post #138
lordlaser9 wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lawyers and investors provide pathways to the market that allow engineers to build things that have actual value. The idea that engineers like you and I hold all of the tools and training to "create wealth" is too dismissive of those professions.

BTW, calling "investors" a "profession" is profoundly insulting to the professions. A profession — canonically, law, medicine, academia, or the clergy — is a vocation that answers to a higher ideal than mere self-interest and obedience. Investors are just people who bought things.

In contemporary American English, “profession” just means “job”.

According to the OED, the word has been used with that sense since the 16th century; it’s not a recent thing.

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