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Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

nytimes.com

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Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#31

Post by duxup »

ummonk wrote: post #13

It doesn't change the criminality of his actions, but something I haven't ever seen any info about: were the designs he downloaded and took with him for LIDAR systems that he had played the primary role in developing while at Google or were the designs largely the work of other Googke employees?

>downloaded more than 14,000 files containing critical information about Google’s autonomous-vehicle research before leaving the company in 2016

Just generally as the act has been described it sounds like the information downloaded was pretty massive and wide ranging.

It seems unlikely he always "played the primary role in developing" all of it. And really you can debate what that quoted phrase means and what the legal ramifications of that are if you were to presume that he could take the things.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#32

Post by AndrewBissell »

dmix wrote: post #27
AndrewBissell wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Musk will be the next Levandowski.

People have such an impetus for Musk's downfall but a few off colour or poorly thought out tweets is nothing compared to something as criminal as downloading everything from your company before starting a competitor. Or worse while you work on the competitor on the side even before leaving the company. Anthony should have known that files are easily tracked in a place like Google and that he'd put a giant spotlight o…

All pretty pale in comparison to a faked $75 billion buyout tweeted out during market trading hours. Or the blatant self-dealing and faked product unveil used to push through the SolarCity bailout.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#33

Post by whatok »

dmix wrote: post #27
AndrewBissell wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Musk will be the next Levandowski.

People have such an impetus for Musk's downfall but a few off colour or poorly thought out tweets is nothing compared to something as criminal as downloading everything from your company before starting a competitor. Or worse while you work on the competitor on the side even before leaving the company. Anthony should have known that files are easily tracked in a place like Google and that he'd put a giant spotlight o…

I'm pretty sure people criticize Elon for more than just a few Tweets.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#34

Post by coldtea »

uuilly wrote: post #14

I used to work for Anthony at 510 systems. He tried to hire me for Otto as well. Watching this whole thing unfold from, obscure story in 2011 to the Waymo Vs. Uber trial to federal charges and national news is rather surreal. Anthony is one of the most creative, energetic thinkers I've ever encountered. If he stopped taking shortcuts he'd probably be the next Jobs or Musk.

>If he stopped taking shortcuts he'd probably be the next Jobs or Musk.

Didn't these ended up where they are by taking all kinds of shortcuts?

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#35

Post by inlined »

throwaway_law wrote: post #25
dekhn wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

levandowski never liked when rules got in the way of progress. his attitude was "whatever it takes to birth self-driving cars".

>never liked when rules got in the way of progress. Yes, that seems to be the Silicon Valley Culture. "Move fast and break things" "Its better to apologize and seek forgiveness, than ask for permission" "Though the most successful founders are usually good people, they tend to have a piratical gleam in their eye. They're not Goody Two-Shoes type good. Morally, they care about getting the big questions right, but not…

I used to go back to my university and speak at the ethics class in my recruiting trips. I stopped after people’s questions changed to “Uber, Airbnb, etc all succeeded because they broke the law. Why are ethics important?” and I had no real answer.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#36

Post by bduerst »

dmix wrote: post #27
AndrewBissell wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Musk will be the next Levandowski.

People have such an impetus for Musk's downfall but a few off colour or poorly thought out tweets is nothing compared to something as criminal as downloading everything from your company before starting a competitor. Or worse while you work on the competitor on the side even before leaving the company. Anthony should have known that files are easily tracked in a place like Google and that he'd put a giant spotlight o…

Yeah, Musk never stole competitor IP, so the comparison is a bit banal.

If anything, Musk's undoing will be how he has handled Tesla, such as his nepotist SolarCity acquisition.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#37

Post by Judgmentality »

dmix wrote: post #27
AndrewBissell wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Musk will be the next Levandowski.

People have such an impetus for Musk's downfall but a few off colour or poorly thought out tweets is nothing compared to something as criminal as downloading everything from your company before starting a competitor. Or worse while you work on the competitor on the side even before leaving the company. Anthony should have known that files are easily tracked in a place like Google and that he'd put a giant spotlight o…

There are a lot more problems with Musk's conduct than a few tweets. Just yesterday there was a post on the front page of HN effectively accusing him of nepotism and saving his family's dying business and merging it with Tesla. There is still a lot of controversy over the marketing/state of Autopilot. There are whistle blowers claiming unsafe working conditions at Tesla and Musk censoring/firing anyone who is pro union. The list goes on.

I'm not saying Musk hasn't created some impressive companies or that he is bound to fail - but he is not without controversy.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#38

Post by TCR19 »

coldtea wrote: post #34
uuilly wrote: post #14

I used to work for Anthony at 510 systems. He tried to hire me for Otto as well. Watching this whole thing unfold from, obscure story in 2011 to the Waymo Vs. Uber trial to federal charges and national news is rather surreal. Anthony is one of the most creative, energetic thinkers I've ever encountered. If he stopped taking shortcuts he'd probably be the next Jobs or Musk.

> If he stopped taking shortcuts he'd probably be the next Jobs or Musk. Didn't these ended up where they are by taking all kinds of shortcuts?

"Good artists copy, Great artists steal" or something along those lines.

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#39

Post by unscrupulous_sw »

> It is not uncommon for tech companies, which fiercely guard their intellectual property, to sue former employees or the firms they join after they leave.

Is it really that common?

I feel like most software engineers don't really take intellectual property all that seriously. Most will not think twice about backing up emails when leaving the company which might contain code diffs, design docs, etc.

Friends from different companies usually talk about internal system designs and technical problems pretty freely. One of the circles I hang out with even backup and share the interview question database from every company they've been at.

So while it's probably crossing a line, it's still not something I expect they will ever get sued for, let alone criminally charged. (This is in contrast with friends from the finance industry who are a lot more tightlipped about everything and you do hear stories about regular employees getting sued)

Re: Anthony Levandowski Charged with Theft of Trade Secrets

#40

Post by tyingq »

asdfasgasdgasdg wrote: post #24
tempsy wrote: post #18

Interesting this is only against Anthony and not Uber this time. The stakes seem much smaller here. I would be surprised if he actually goes to prison for this. And max fine of $8 million or so is small for him

The maximum penalty is 250k per count or twice the gross gain/loss, whichever is greater. So the financial penalty could be quite significant.

Wouldn't a conviction open him up to a more costly civil suit? Harder to defend a civil suit if you're guilty in a related criminal charge.
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