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The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

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Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#161

Post by onepointsixC »

sdenton4 wrote: post #156
word-reader wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How has immigration policy in the US become "explicitly racist"? Immigration law has essentially remained unchanged. DACA was repealed, but DACA was an executive action not partial to country of origin. H-1B denials have increased, but based on pre-existing requirements and quotas. Administrative changes in asylum rules and public charge requirements affect every immigrant regardless of country of origin or race.

Remember the Muslim ban? That was racist. You know, for starters...

Banning visas from a list of failed states was not racist. You can say the rhetoric surrounding it was, but not the policy itself.

Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#162

Post by onepointsixC »

openasocket wrote: post #113
pacala wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

75% or more of asylum claims from central americans are ultimately denied. https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/03/world/us-asylum-denial-rates-...

Doesn't matter though, they are still not breaking the law. There are a lot of factors involved in those numbers. For starters, immigration court does not provide public defenders. If you can't afford a lawyer, and can't find a lawyer willing to work pro bono, you have to represent yourself. Yes, even if you are a minor. And having an attorney, according to your article, makes it 5x more likely for your claim to be a…

>they are still not breaking the law.

Yes they are, illegally entering the United States is breaking the law.

Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#163

Post by totoasticot »

I'm maybe wrong, but I would like to share some ideas.

Where does this money is coming from ? I mean, does the whole question isn't a level "above" : why does such entity exists in a democratic gouvernement ? Isn't it showing a deep loophole in the system ? Same idea : how is this entity funded ? Isn't it with US-citizens's taxes ? So, aren't all US-citizens involved in this story as well ? Why would Palantir's employees be more involved than all the persons that allowed the money to be there for Palantir to be funded ?

I'm seeing more Palantir as a consequence of a system's failure than its premice.

Woild love to discuss about that however.

Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#164

Post by belltaco »

tastygreenapple wrote: post #125
anthony_doan wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I am not from USA but why every comment here is implying ICE to be some evil thing. Because there are reports of ICE doing inhumane things toward the people they have detained. 1) Children are being separated from families. 2) Children are dying under ICE facilities. 3) The jailing of asylum seekers. These are the few things that lead many people to believe ICE is evil. Where as the other side seems to be concentra…

but none of these features are new, child seperation and children dying in ICE facilities happened under the Obama administration and it wasn't a big deal then. What changed?

>but none of these features are new, child seperation and children dying in ICE facilities happened under the Obama administration and it wasn't a big deal then. What changed?

Not really. Here are some things that changed.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/08/21/us/politics/fact-check-tr...

Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#165

Post by snowwrestler »

immaway wrote: post #145
wpietri wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. I think it's reasonable (although perhaps naive) for people to have a sunny view of law enforcement. Especially when, like me, they're white men from middle-class backgrounds; I've never had a bad experience with law enforcement, despite having done some stupendously dumb-ass things. But even though I'm predisposed to view cops favorably, the stuff with ICE is shocking to me. America has a big chunk of histo…

Enforcing the rules that people have to obey to get and stay in the country. That isn't ethnic cleansing. Plenty of people who are not white people come to the country legally every year.

ICE and CBP are targeting legal residents and even U.S. citizens, and attempting to deport them, if they are Hispanic. See for example:

https://www.gq.com/story/border-patrol-incarcerated-citizen

ICE and CBP have repeatedly violated U.S. law in their treatment of children, including violating the Flores Settlement (which carries the force of U.S. law), violating Constitutional due process and equal protection rights (ruled in Ms. L case), and violated the civil rights guaranteed under U.S. and international law, for example by refusing to provide hygiene materials and medicine.

Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#166

Post by nabnob »

1111236112347 wrote: post #48
caymanjim wrote: post #39

Palantir's entire business is providing data mining and surveillance software to government agencies. ICE is probably the least-morally-reprehensible thing they support. They are deeply involved with DHS, CIA, NSA, all manner of classified agencies. If any of their employees have a problem with ICE, they never belonged there in the first place.

> Palantir's entire business is providing data mining and surveillance software to government agencies. Palantir has a number of commercial customers, here's a few examples: https://www.palantir.com/palantir-foundry/impact/

>Its two main products are Palantir Gotham and Palantir Metropolis, more geeky winks from a company whose Tolkien namesake is a type of magical sphere used by the evil lord Sauron to surveil, trick, and threaten his enemies across Middle Earth. While Palantir Metropolis is pegged to quantitative analysis for Wall Street banks and hedge funds, Gotham (formerly Palantir Government) is designed for the needs of intelligence, law enforcement, and homeland security customers.

https://theintercept.com/2017/02/22/how-peter-thiels-palanti...

Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#167

Post by bostik »

zelon88 wrote: post #141
creaghpatr wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, if Mexican heroin killed multiple people you know, you have a not-sunny view of illegal immigrants and unsecured borders. Just because you attribute your own ignorance to the color of your skin, doesn't mean others do.

I'm sorry to hear you may have experienced this. But is it really fair to call it "Mexican" heroin? Is that a bonafide statement or an assumption? Lethal drugs don't explicitly come from outside the US, and in the presence of stronger border security the supply-demand curve would just re-balance itself with an all domestic supply. Heroin has always been illegal. Illegally crossing the border has always been illegal.…

> Heroin has always been illegal.

Not wanting to stamp on any of your other arguments, but the quoted statement ignores historical facts.

Heroin was sold, and actively marketed, as a medication to calm overly active children.[0] Mommy reaching for a bottle of gin to calm her nerves is tame, compared to mommy handing out heroin to the little monster just so the darn creature would give her a bit of rest.

0: https://www.businessinsider.com/yes-bayer-promoted-heroin-fo...

Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#168

Post by onepointsixC »

sp332 wrote: post #17
mulmen wrote: post #2

Maybe I misunderstand Palantir's mission but working with LEOs like ICE seems to be their core business. All credit to these employees for standing up for what they believe in but what exactly did they think they were signing up for? I have a new coworker who wears his Palantir t-shirt and it makes me uncomfortable to even see the name in my office.

The ICE thing has gotten dramatically worse recently. Accepting a certain level of abuse of power in other LE agencies doesn't necessarily mean they're OK with, say, actively pushing back against a DoJ settlement so they can hold children in detention indefinitely, etc.

>actively pushing back against a DoJ settlement so they can hold children in detention indefinitely, etc.

So they're horrible abusers if they separate children and now that they are trying to rectify that by keeping children together with family by removing the detention limit they too are abusers. What would make you happy then? The only alternative is open borders which is a non starter.

Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#169

Post by belltaco »

word-reader wrote: post #142
CydeWeys wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I interviewed with Palantir maybe seven years ago (didn't get the job) and definitely wasn't aware at the time that they were doing this kind of work, if they even were back then. And had I known they were doing CBP stuff, I may have been OK with it under Obama even. It wasn't until Trump got elected and immigration policy became explicitly racist and enforcement child-separationy and concentration-campy that I reall…

How has immigration policy in the US become "explicitly racist"? Immigration law has essentially remained unchanged. DACA was repealed, but DACA was an executive action not partial to country of origin. H-1B denials have increased, but based on pre-existing requirements and quotas. Administrative changes in asylum rules and public charge requirements affect every immigrant regardless of country of origin or race.

Racist laws would be struck down, so it's not surprising that it's not explicit. However the political racist undertones are unmistakable.

https://beta.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-attacks-prote...

Regarding H-1B's, DHS almost made a decision to make many people on work visas criminals with a catch-22 situation because of the delays in processing H1 extensions. I wish I was making this up.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/stuartanderson/2018/07/11/new-u...

Re: The war inside Palantir: Data-mining firm ties to ICE under attack by employees

#170

Post by openasocket »

onepointsixC wrote: post #162
openasocket wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Doesn't matter though, they are still not breaking the law. There are a lot of factors involved in those numbers. For starters, immigration court does not provide public defenders. If you can't afford a lawyer, and can't find a lawyer willing to work pro bono, you have to represent yourself. Yes, even if you are a minor. And having an attorney, according to your article, makes it 5x more likely for your claim to be a…

>they are still not breaking the law. Yes they are, illegally entering the United States is breaking the law.

Not according to Title 8 Section 1158, in the first sentence: "Any alien who is physically present in the United States or who arrives in the United States (whether or not at a designated port of arrival and including an alien who is brought to the United States after having been interdicted in international or United States waters), irrespective of such alien’s status, may apply for asylum in accordance with this section or, where applicable, section 1225(b) of this title."

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1158

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