Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss • Hacker News Board

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#111

Post by kernelPan1c » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:19 PM UTC

RobertRoberts wrote: post #67

throwaway5752 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't want to sound harsh, but you're wrong because you're missing the point, and badly. The author talks about cancer diagnoses. This is an apt analogy, and there is a huge body of science for helping individuals cope with personal tragedy. Global warming is a global and personal tragedy. People will have their livelihoods ruined, and people will die. People already have, but (since this is a anglophile community)…

Do you want to feel better about the climate? Or actually fix it? I'd rather have a cold hard doctor that fixes my cancer, than feel good about dying.

Agreed, this is a problem that we will solve through scientific innovation in power generation (nuclear) and carbon sequestration. The solutions that fall in the emotional domain often involve legislation and a reduction in quality of life.

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#112

Post by youareawesome » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:19 PM UTC

Pinckney wrote: post #85

SolaceQuantum wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't diving into the world of doomsday preppers assist you in planning? (I mean, stereotyping aside that they're all crackpots or w/e surely they'd be useful for the literal thing they're trying to do.)

"Doomsday planning for less crazy folks" is pretty good: http://lcamtuf.coredump.cx/prep/

This is great, thank you!

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#113

Post by watbywbarif » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:20 PM UTC

Sorry man, but all your hopes look pretty bad (as any other average eco-enthusiast hopes do).

1. Renewable energy (solar and wind mainly) is shitty mostly, not delivering, huge resources required, and huge backup battery/hydro storage required. SOLUTION = Nuclear

2. EV cars are junk, poorly packed energy, much less than gasoline per kg, giving bad range and big mass overhead to vehicle (meaning also bigger energy consumption). You just feel eco but price is paid in electrical infrastructure / power-plants / battery materials. SOLUTION=Nuclear again, then you can pack your cheap electricity back to chemical energy and use totally clean ICE which now has totally clean exhaustion (no impure fossil shit).

3. Recycling (although not highlighted in article) is waste of time and resources (mostly), moving junk around the globe so that you can feel green :D SOLUTION=Nuclear again, just get abundant cheep electricity and burn it with plasma torches. Don't send you garbage to China, even they don't want it.

In short, Fusion would be great, Fission will save us also. Just stop wasting time/money/resources on other stupid ideas that change nothing and sometimes do more harm than original solution they have replaced.

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#114

Post by thomasfromcdnjs » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:21 PM UTC

I don't even know why I have to be called a climate change denier or skeptic. The onus is on people who believe the climate is changing to prove it. As to say, it is not my job to disprove something that hasn't been proved.

Now obviously there is "proof" in circulation. But what is it proving? Have any prediction targets been met at all? How much will the sea tides rise and when? How much would have they risen given natural cycles? Even if man mad emissions weren't affecting the temperature would a climate scientist be able to predict the temperature 5 years from now?

Nasa has a few articles about how Earth is much greener than 40 years ago due to global warming -> https://climate.nasa.gov/climate_resources/3/graphic-warmer-....

Are we simply waiting for this new vegetation to mature and reduce carbon emissions? Is anyone factoring in potential plant growth? Could they even measure that? Maybe the earth knows how to naturally cycle?

As I've aged, all I have seen is men make futile predictions about everything under the sun. The more and more variables and extrapolations added to a problem generally leads to an exponentially bad answer. I'm sure anyone who works in a job that does heavy spread sheet work can twist any bunch of numbers to fit a departments desired figure.

Furthermore, the mass fervour of the world for climate change should induce skepticism. Where is everyone getting their sources from?

Arguments such as:

"Think about the children" "Save the planet"

Are typically go to answers of people who can't make a real point.

Now it is not anyone's fault that they should act hysterical, the authority that is trickling down all this information should be a bit more out spoken. The media also needs to drop the term "experts" and "scientists".

I'd just like to know, in 10 years from now, if carbon emissions were at 19th century level, what would be the temperature be? and at our current rate of carbon emission what will the temperature be? With what degree of accuracy will the figure hold up to? Other then reducing man made emissions, what other planetary behaviour will also reduce carbon emissions? Can they be predicted and have you included them in the report?

Not even going to bother with the political aspect of this all, which actually may well be the majority of this movement. If I truely believed climate change were a real problem for the world, as the above posted said, I would be going after all the billion person populations first and foremost.

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#115

Post by melling » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:21 PM UTC

RobertRoberts wrote: post #25

alexandercrohde wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. It really touches on the emotional aspects of it, which I think really need to be discussed. When I picture why certain family members have a hard time accepting the reality of global warming, it certainly comes down to difficulty grappling with emotions, not a hard review of the literature. Recognizing emotions as part of the problem and solution feels like a big step.

>Recognizing emotions as part of the problem and solution feels like a big step. I think this is actually the worst thing we can do. Science is facts, cold hard facts. If you want to get rid of the science and focus on emotions, then the solutions to the _real_ problem will get distorted.

“The climate is always changing”

After you’ve had 100 people tell you that, you’ll probably change your mind.

Social media has made the problem worse. For some reason, deniers flood the discussion with silly statements like that.

I keep the xkcd cartoon handy for any discussions:

https://xkcd.com/1732/

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#116

Post by thomasfromcdnjs » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:23 PM UTC

Eh surely RonaldSchleifer comment shouldn't have been killed by flagging.

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#117

Post by s_y_n_t_a_x » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:25 PM UTC

Mikeb85 wrote: post #90

navigatesol wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China and India contribute 4-10 times less CO2 per capita than the US. And rising, fast. Besides that, the planet doesn't care about per capita numbers.

People do though. Why should we stunt the developing world's growth just because we've already fucked things up too much? Seems like colonialism all over; the West gets to keep polluting, but the developing world must stop developing?

The West doesn't get to have a huge population (nor does it need or want one) why should the developing world have one?

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#118

Post by ptah » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:28 PM UTC

OmegaBlight wrote: post #3

throwaway5752 wrote: post #2

This is a really good article. It touches on the global denial, the gross generational inequality of the status quo, and acknowledges the personal mental health difficulty in trying to accept what the human race has done. It's also pragmatic and talks about what's being done. Very worthwhile reading in its entirety.

Do you think we as society are going to change fast enough to combat the challenges we are currently facing? It seems that we are all just repeating past mistakes in a grander scale.

my current view is that the change will happen to us regardless. we will be forced to respond in some way

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#119

Post by RankingMember » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:29 PM UTC

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #38

bloopernova wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That cuts deep. It's very easy to put things off and believe that I'm helpless. Thank you for being blunt about it. I'll do something today about the climate and planting trees. I'm not physically able to plant stuff myself, so it will have to be something I donate to. I can also push my employer to start sponsoring climate disaster mitigation efforts.

You might want to consider donating to some of the groups that have sprung up. Two that have had recent visibility are: Extinction Rebellion, organisers of the civil disobedience protests in the UK and elsewhere - https://rebellion.earth Client Earth, a legal charity aiming to repeatedly take governments to court on climate matters. Became much more visible when Dave Gilmour made a major donation recently: https://ww…

Got any good US-based charity recommendations? Both of those seem Euro-centric.

Re: Yes, I’m Feeling Bad About Climate Change. Let’s Discuss

#120

Post by kilian » Thu, Aug 22, 2019, 3:31 PM UTC

PorterDuff wrote: post #81

growlist wrote: post #53

Nobody mention population.

Exactly. Any time overpopulation isn't mentioned as a (or 'the') primary cause, my nictitating membranes close up and I lose interest in reading.

I have a hard time seeing the overpopulation argument as anything other than classist and racist nonsense.

It's not the vast majority in developing nations that are using up all our fossil fuels and poisoning the planet, it's us. And the damage being done in developing nations is nearly all to serve our needs in the developed world. We are the problem.