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Why All of Our Games Look Like Crap

jeff-vogel.blogspot.com

11–20 of 552 posts

Re: Why All of Our Games Look Like Crap

#11
post #3

The graphics immediately reminded me of Tibia ( https://www.tibia.com/news ), the MMO running since 1997. My friends were into it at one point, and I cut my programming teeth writing bots for the game (sorry CIPsoft). Kind of sad to see the playership has been in decline for the last 10 years though :(.

> https://www.tibia.com/news

I miss websites which look like this

Re: Why All of Our Games Look Like Crap

#12
I think the problem is that the game is in Uncanny Valley.

It's trying to achieve a certain level of detail/realism, but it's falling short of expectations.

This might be completely intentional, to evoke a feel for games from an era that did the same thing, but comparing to Baba is You highlights the developer doesn't understand that.

Baba is You has gone completely in the opposite direction in terms of graphical detail, come out of the Uncanny Valley, and is now sitting atop Cuteness Peak.

The dev needs to decide where he wants the game to sit and why.

Re: Why All of Our Games Look Like Crap

#13
post #10

ITT: lots of people missing the point that he doesn't actually believe his games look like crap, he's just made a conscious (and profitable) decision to go retro. He likes his games' visual style and values the freelancers who produce the art. I didn't think this is a difficult point but apparently it is.

I don't dislike retro games, actually love the art style of Streets of Rogue and KeeperRL, for example, and I agree it's a great way for indies to get budget under control - it's easy to be tempted to just get better art, but then animation, collisions, interactions etc still need to be coded and contribute significantly to development time.

that said, what makes these game look at least weird is the combination of very retro tiles (say, 1994is, master of magic level) with late retro higher def sprites (say, 1998ish?, baldur's gate level)

while going retro style is not a bad decision for indies, the graphic and ux suffer from being mixed styles, and that's imho a valid criticism.

Re: Why All of Our Games Look Like Crap

#15
post #12

I think the problem is that the game is in Uncanny Valley. It's trying to achieve a certain level of detail/realism, but it's falling short of expectations. This might be completely intentional, to evoke a feel for games from an era that did the same thing, but comparing to Baba is You highlights the developer doesn't understand that. Baba is You has gone completely in the opposite direction in terms of graphical det…

The article explains in detail where he wants the game to sit and why. Sorry, I don't follow.

Re: Why All of Our Games Look Like Crap

#16

There's a difference between a conscious choice to maintain a certain style or level of detail, and a lack of willingness to improve said style. The whole article reads to me less like "I don't want to upgrade to 3D or higher detail" and more like "I'm too comfortable to want to improve the current art by putting in 10% more detail". Disclaimer: I'm not a business owner and don't work in the games industry. My opinio…

> There's a difference between a conscious choice to maintain a certain style or level of detail, and a lack of willingness to improve said style. The whole article reads to me less like "I don't want to upgrade to 3D or higher detail" and more like "I'm too comfortable to want to improve the current art by putting in 10% more detail". He has an entire section dedicated to this issue though. Which boils down to the f…

I think he doesn't understand why people say the games look bad (and people may have trouble articulating the real reasons too); I believe 'meheleventyone captured the root issue elsewhere[0] - the game he presented has inconsistent, crappy style. Which can be contrasted to other simple games he uses as a justification - these games look well because they have a particular style.

The solution isn't to go 3D, or add more details - it's to get one artist responsible for the overall style and refactor art relentlessly so that it all fits together. It should be entirely within his budget.

--

[0] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20766174

Re: Why All of Our Games Look Like Crap

#17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's a difference between a conscious choice to maintain a certain style or level of detail, and a lack of willingness to improve said style. The whole article reads to me less like "I don't want to upgrade to 3D or higher detail" and more like "I'm too comfortable to want to improve the current art by putting in 10% more detail". He has an entire section dedicated to this issue though. Which boils down to the f…

I think he doesn't understand why people say the games look bad (and people may have trouble articulating the real reasons too); I believe 'meheleventyone captured the root issue elsewhere[0] - the game he presented has inconsistent, crappy style. Which can be contrasted to other simple games he uses as a justification - these games look well because they have a particular style. The solution isn't to go 3D, or add m…

He explains why he doesn't want to get a single permanent artist in the article. A few times.

Re: Why All of Our Games Look Like Crap

#18

>made by a team of freelancers, to our specifications So...did these freelancers not communicate with each other at all? When I saw the first screenshot on the page, of the newest game, I thought it was composed entirely of assets purchased from an asset store and built in RPG Maker and I expected the body of the article to be centered on why it's ok to buy assets when what you're focusing on is gameplay. I feel like…

He doesn't have a cadre of artists. They might not be working concurrently in the same game. He specifically says multiple times that they come and go, life happens.

I guess there's an argument to be made that he could focus on better and better specifications for those artists so, over time, the style stays consistent. But I dont know anything about that. Seems doable?

Re: Why All of Our Games Look Like Crap

#20
post #10

ITT: lots of people missing the point that he doesn't actually believe his games look like crap, he's just made a conscious (and profitable) decision to go retro. He likes his games' visual style and values the freelancers who produce the art. I didn't think this is a difficult point but apparently it is.

There are better and worse ways to make retro looking games, and there are ways to care about the look of your game without having it noticeably effect your budget.

The most confusing part of the whole story is that his latest game looks noticeably worse than his two previous games. So there seems to be something more going on beyond that he just wants to go low budget and retro. The problem doesn't seem to primarily be the budget or the quality of the art per se, but a lack of care when it comes to art direction.

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