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Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

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Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#151

Post by SomeOldThrow »

abstractbarista wrote: post #93
JamesBarney wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smoking is one of the leading risk factors for cardiovascular disease: agreed It starts earlier than a lot of people thought: agreed The primary contributor to smoking's detrimental effects on the cardiovascular system is nicotine: disagree Mind linking to something that shows this? That doesn't agree with the results from the UK study on effects of nicotine versus smoking which puts nicotine's effects at about 5% of…

This is definitely a point which needs more exploring. Seems to me most damage from smoking is all the crap in smoking. The chemical nicotine - by itself - transiently raises BP, feels nice, and that's about it. It's also only a part of the addictiveness of smoking. Probably a small part, as everyone I know who has consumed nicotine in any form has no trouble without it if they vape, but often shows discomfort/restle…

> The chemical nicotine - by itself - transiently raises BP, feels nice, and that's about it.

This is not entirely true. I believe it can put you at risk for cardiac arrhythmia, and the risk goes up steeply the more nicotine you intake to simply cardiac arrest. I believe this is depicted in Thank You For Smoking when the protagonist is covered in nicotine patches and almost dies. It’s entirely possible that was do to BP issues but I wouldn’t dismiss it as trivial in that case.

Also if you read about the native american experience of smoking uncured tobacco, it seems like it was likely a near death shamanic experience and it did kill people occasionally.

That said, it’s rather easy to moderate your intake with the percentages, so it’s not a problem for most people (I hope).

Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#152

Post by wyre »

mikelyons wrote: post #121
mzs wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Careful, in addition to constricting/hardening blood vessels that is thought to lead to heart disease nicotine has other long term effects as seen in in this study of angiogenesis: >In a series of experiments, the researchers found that nicotine could enhance new blood vessel growth in mice whose hind limbs were artificially starved of oxygen. They also found that lung cancer cells implanted into mice grew more quick…

Nicotine is also, itself, a known carcinogen.

May I ask for a source on that? AFAIK the reason why cigarettes cause disease is because of the tar and all of the other byproducts of the Burning tobacco and that nicotine by itself is not the cause. I can't find a source of the top of my head but I smoked cigarettes for 4 years and enjoyed reading on them.

Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#153

Post by EvilTerran »

mrfusion wrote: post #139
abstractbarista wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is definitely a point which needs more exploring. Seems to me most damage from smoking is all the crap in smoking. The chemical nicotine - by itself - transiently raises BP, feels nice, and that's about it. It's also only a part of the addictiveness of smoking. Probably a small part, as everyone I know who has consumed nicotine in any form has no trouble without it if they vape, but often shows discomfort/restle…

Is there any research on what other chemicals might be addictive?

Here's one: https://www.jneurosci.org/content/25/38/8593

Abstract:

Nicotine is the major neuroactive compound of tobacco, which has, by itself, weak reinforcing properties. It is known that levels of the enzymes monoamine oxidase A (MAO-A) and MAO-B are reduced in the platelets and brains of smokers and that substances, other than nicotine, present in tobacco smoke have MAO-inhibitory activities. Here, we report that inhibition of MAO dramatically and specifically increases the motivation to self-administer nicotine in rats. These effects were more prominent in rats selected for high responsiveness to novelty than in rats with low responsiveness to novelty. The results suggest that the inhibition of MAO activity by compounds present in tobacco smoke may combine with nicotine to produce the intense reinforcing properties of cigarette smoking that lead to addiction.

Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#154

Post by JamesBarney »

JamesBarney wrote: post #98
abstractbarista wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is definitely a point which needs more exploring. Seems to me most damage from smoking is all the crap in smoking. The chemical nicotine - by itself - transiently raises BP, feels nice, and that's about it. It's also only a part of the addictiveness of smoking. Probably a small part, as everyone I know who has consumed nicotine in any form has no trouble without it if they vape, but often shows discomfort/restle…

I think I remember reading some research at some point that backs this up, if I remember correctly they found it was a lot easier to get rats addicted to smoking than nicotine

Yep evilterran linked to the study I was thinking about.

Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#155

Post by ozzmotik »

mturmon wrote: post #147
ozzmotik wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

sometimes i really wish that people would actually tell me why they downvote what I have to say, rather than just silently doing so and condemning me to the bottom of the comments. i can't really really do the revision part of performance, feedback, revision without any actual feedback of substance to inform me as to what it is that I did wrong in the first place.

Downvotes usually equilibrate "correctly" over time. Best response to downvotes is to re-read and see if anything said was wrong or inflammatory, and if not, just wait it out. In general, I'd say that using proper capitalization and avoiding walls of text - stripping down to your actual point - would help your comments.

oh interesting, i never seem to find mine to equilibriate over time; they generally get zero engagement. i honestly did not realize that people really put that much import into proper capitalization; i figured most people understand that, given the heavy market share of mobile users, that most of the time, all lowercase text is more often an intentional choice and not necessarily one made of intellectual laziness.

as for the wall of text thing, that certainly makes sense to me. i always have a tendency to write those, and i could understand why others would find them cumbersome to parse. all in all, good advice, and i highly thank you for sharing it with me. i suppose i may have to rethink how i present myself here, esp wrt the whole orthography of my posts :)

Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#156

Post by jodrellblank »

thom wrote: post #127
kryogen1c wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I smoked for ~3 years and one of my favorite smoking memories was with a doctor in San Diego. He was going down the standard visit questionnaire and asked if i smoked, so I said yes. He put down his pen, looked me in the eye, and loudly said "STOP". He looked back at the form, picked up his pen, and we carried on.

I don't know if your doctor or anyone in this thread is aware of the classic Bob Newhart sketch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ow0lr63y4Mw

Or the Fry and Laurie "Dr Tobacco" sketch:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XewVicFzRxw

Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#157

Post by jdietrich »

p1necone wrote: post #131
Medicalidiot wrote: post #39

The number one controllable risk factor for stroke and heart attack is smoking. By far. Not diet, not exercise, smoking. A significant part of that is because nicotine will constrict blood vessels leading to hypertension[1], this leads to destruction of the surface of an artery, leading to atherosclerosis formation. One day the atherosclerotic plaque ruptures and then you see me. We once thought that atherosclerosis…

Does that mean that caffeine is a risk too? Doesn't it have similar effects to nicotine? (I drink a loooooot of coffee).

The evidence is inconclusive. Some studies show slightly higher all-cause mortality for coffee drinkers, some studies show slightly lower mortality. Either way, the effect size is clinically insignificant.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24279995

Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#158

Post by fiblye »

JamesBarney wrote: post #64
Duhck wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the supporting evidence for your concern that "attacks on vaping are for the purpose of driving smokers back to cigarettes" Philip Morris (now known as Altria) put $13bn into Juul to do the exact opposite. The margins on vaping are higher, the current perception of vaping is that it's better than smoking, and it's way easier to get kids addicted to vaping than cigarettes. I see too much evidence to the contrar…

It's not hard to say it's better than smoking. Every study done to date comparing the two days it's not nearly as harmful as smoking. Smoking is one of the most harmful things you can possibly do to your body. Many people underestimate how much of a low bar being better than smoking is.

Vaping has been mainstream for what, a little over 5 years? And it’s exploded in just the past couple years. Any research coming out saying it’s not dangerous is simply premature. Most young people who start smoking don’t really notice majorly harmful effects within their first couple years either. At this point, most studies can only demonstrate the short term effects. It’ll take a while to determine long term harm.

Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#159

Post by dubyah »

p1necone wrote: post #131
Medicalidiot wrote: post #39

The number one controllable risk factor for stroke and heart attack is smoking. By far. Not diet, not exercise, smoking. A significant part of that is because nicotine will constrict blood vessels leading to hypertension[1], this leads to destruction of the surface of an artery, leading to atherosclerosis formation. One day the atherosclerotic plaque ruptures and then you see me. We once thought that atherosclerosis…

Does that mean that caffeine is a risk too? Doesn't it have similar effects to nicotine? (I drink a loooooot of coffee).

Coffee's fine. https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/full/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA....

A nonlinear association between coffee consumption and CVD risk was observed in this meta-analysis. Moderate coffee consumption was inversely significantly associated with CVD risk, with the lowest CVD risk at 3 to 5 cups per day, and heavy coffee consumption was not associated with elevated CVD risk.

Re: Acute Effects of Electronic Cigarette Aerosol Inhalation on Vascular Function

#160

Post by jdietrich »

mikelyons wrote: post #121
mzs wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Careful, in addition to constricting/hardening blood vessels that is thought to lead to heart disease nicotine has other long term effects as seen in in this study of angiogenesis: >In a series of experiments, the researchers found that nicotine could enhance new blood vessel growth in mice whose hind limbs were artificially starved of oxygen. They also found that lung cancer cells implanted into mice grew more quick…

Nicotine is also, itself, a known carcinogen.

Not according to the IARC.

https://monographs.iarc.fr/list-of-classifications

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