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A parrot has a question for humans

nautil.us

31–40 of 75 posts

Re: A parrot has a question for humans

#31
Nice, I read the whole thing before noticing that Ted Chiang wrote this. Off topic, but I have really been his and sci-fi from China.

I have owned a Meyers Parrot for over 15 years. We got him from a local breeder as a baby and hand fed him. I question the morality of owning such smart animals as pets, but that aside, he is a great pet. Parrots do require at least a few hours of interaction time a day from their owners. Right now mine is next to me beating up on his bell toy. He will only do this when someone is watching him. Anyway, don’t get a parrot unless you have a lot of free time.

Re: A parrot has a question for humans

#32

If I had billions I would retreat to an island somewhere and try to bring back the dinosaurs by breeding super ostriches or something like that.

> bring back the dinosaurs There are several movies about why this is a bad idea.

There are also several movies about faster-than-light spaceships which are crewed by humans even during combat. Movies should not be the basis for an argument.

Re: A parrot has a question for humans

#34
post #5

The author, Ted Chiang, recently released his book of short stories, Exhalation. This story is included in the book. It's good, but not as good as his first book, imo, "Story of Your Life and Others". Story of Your Life was the inspiration for the movie "Arrival". That book was amazing.

Thanks for the recommendation. I am part way through Exhalation, and I just bought “Story of Your Life and Others”. I really liked the movie Arrival - it is one of the few movies that I have purchased so I can watch it whenever I want.

We really do live in a world with so much great entertainment in the forms of literary art and movies.

Re: A parrot has a question for humans

#35
post #19

From Richard Stallman's Rider: https://github.com/ddol/rre-rms/blob/master/rider.txt >If you can find a host for me that has a friendly parrot, I will be very very glad. If you can find someone who has a friendly parrot I can visit with, that will be nice too. >DON'T buy a parrot figuring that it will be a fun surprise for me. To acquire a parrot is a major decision: it is likely to outlive you. If you don't know how…

I love birds. Volunteered at a wild bird rescue, wish I had 100 of them, love visiting any place with parrots when travelling. But I would never buy a bird. Offering a better place for one who no longer has anyone to take care of it is great, but promoting breeding and sales of captive intelligent animals feels very wrong.

As a long time parrot owner, sadly I must agree with you. I devote about two hours a day to my parrot, and even at that he wants even more attention. Volunteering at a parrot rescue organization is probably the better alternative to owning a parrot.

Re: A parrot has a question for humans

#36

If I had billions I would retreat to an island somewhere and try to bring back the dinosaurs by breeding super ostriches or something like that.

> bring back the dinosaurs There are several movies about why this is a bad idea.

Same for AI, but it's not stopping us so far

Re: A parrot has a question for humans

#37
post #9

Years and years ago, there was an aol live chat with Koko, the gorilla who could sign. An early experimental cross species AMA. The crowd mostly asked questions like "is there a god?" The ape generally replied that she was bored and wanted food. Gray parrots and corvids and dolphins and squids are exceptionally fascinating and worth studying. They aren't the same as the mythologized first contact people are hoping fo…

Why would anyone expect an ape to be thinking about anything that's not food or, you know, ape-level? I mean come on, if you asked a random human you wouldn't get an insightful answer to "is there a God." If you wired up a fish to a computer so it could talk you would find out it was thinking about fish stuff.

Re: A parrot has a question for humans

#38
post #9

Years and years ago, there was an aol live chat with Koko, the gorilla who could sign. An early experimental cross species AMA. The crowd mostly asked questions like "is there a god?" The ape generally replied that she was bored and wanted food. Gray parrots and corvids and dolphins and squids are exceptionally fascinating and worth studying. They aren't the same as the mythologized first contact people are hoping fo…

Stanisław Lem's Sci-Fi focused on that concept a lot - that yes, we might find intelligent life in the universe, but it might be so completely different, so alien to us, that any form of communication is not as much impossible, but simply pointless.

Stanislaw Lem 1921-2006

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/weekly-standard/stanislaw...

> Lem's IQ, as he mentioned in passing in an autobiographical essay (it was measured when he was in high school), was above 180, but no one who read many of his books needed that datum to conclude that here was an unusually powerful and wide-ranging intelligence. The son of a physician, Lem was trained in the sciences. Biology was his field, but in his mid-twenties he became a research assistant at what he described as a "kind of clearinghouse for scientific literature" in many disciplines coming into Poland from around the world.

Examples, I think especially are

- "Eden" -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eden_%28Lem_novel%29

Not as extreme as the other two in highlighting the impossibility of meaningful contact. Lem becomes much more skeptical later in his career. Because they actually do make contact to one individual alien and communicate with it. In Fiasco there is some communication but it turn out to be all completely different than expected base don human assumptions (and it all ends in the humans destroying everything, of course all from good intentions). In "Solaris" there is no meaningful communication at all, one can't even say there are misunderstandings.

- "The Invincible" -- "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Invincible"

This is about non-biological self-replicating swarming alien micro-robotic life forms.

- "Solaris" -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solaris_%28novel%29

> Solaris chronicles the ultimate futility of attempted communications with the extraterrestrial life inhabiting a distant alien planet named Solaris. The planet is almost completely covered with an ocean of gel that is revealed to be a single, planet-encompassing organism. Terran scientists conclude it is a sentient being and attempt to communicate with it.

- "His Master's Voice" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/His_Master%27s_Voice_%28novel%...

> The novel is written as a first-person narrative, the memoir of a mathematician named Peter Hogarth, who becomes involved in a Pentagon-directed project (code-named "His Master's Voice", or HMV for short[2]) in the Nevada desert, where scientists are working to decode what seems to be a message from outer space (specifically, a neutrino signal from the Canis Minor constellation)

- "Fiasco" -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiasco_%28novel%29

> The book is a further elaboration of Lem's skepticism: in Lem's opinion, the difficulty in communication with alien civilizations is cultural disparity rather than spatial distance. The failure to communicate with an alien civilization is the main theme of the book.

Re: A parrot has a question for humans

#39
post #9

Years and years ago, there was an aol live chat with Koko, the gorilla who could sign. An early experimental cross species AMA. The crowd mostly asked questions like "is there a god?" The ape generally replied that she was bored and wanted food. Gray parrots and corvids and dolphins and squids are exceptionally fascinating and worth studying. They aren't the same as the mythologized first contact people are hoping fo…

This is something that the later books in the enders game series starts to look at, with the natives of a planet, their origins and even the Formica. They're not quite like the first two books in the series which is why I've seen a number of people not like them (if you want more of that, the bean side series is better) but they're really good still.

Re: A parrot has a question for humans

#40

Speaking of dolphins (and whales for that matter), there is a reason why it has been so hard to not just "communicate" with them but to even understand the function and the meaning of a number of calls they make.It appears that it is very hard for a human mind to understand a consciousness so different from our own. We are visual species, and even though our language is acoustic, it reflects our nature as visual spec…

We know a lot about the language of large ocean mammals but it's just not as one to one with how we would translate it. The ocean is basically a noisy internet with their calls like alien packets that are mixed with a complex natural langue. Elephants have a similar thing. They make long sub-bass vocalizations that they can feel for miles with their feet.

As far as I know, prarie dog [0] is the closest we've come to a rosetta stone for another species. We can translate things like "brown fox north" and such.

[0] https://www.npr.org/2011/01/20/132650631/new-language-discov...

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