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We Have Ruined Childhood

nytimes.com

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Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#211

Post by shioyama »

Izkata wrote: post #192
lonelappde wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please stop spreading falsehoods about America.

It's a rare thing, but it is a thing: https://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/07/arreste... https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/... https://geekdad.com/2015/01/kids-play-arrested/ https://www.cnn.com/2014/07/31/living/florida-mom-arrested-s... https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2015/04/13/parent... I didn't even have to dig to find these, they're from the first page of result…

Thanks, and to respond to another sibling comment: this may be rare in statistical terms, but it is more than real enough to motivate a very clear pattern of behaviour among parents (not allowing kids to roam freely, etc)

I speak from experience having had people (including family) be shocked at how free our kids are here in Japan versus the experience in North America. Whether the media are making things worse (probably) is besides the point: you can get arrested for this as a parent. That's completely absurd and would not even be understood (let alone accepted) in many other countries, including Japan.

Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#212

Post by seanmcdirmid »

Gibbon1 wrote: post #204
Semaphor wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and (I hear) Europe as well From what I’ve seen in Germany, not much seems to have changed since I was a kid.

Some French lady ten years ago got into a big mess because she parked her stroller out in front of a coffee shop and went inside. Cops and CPS took her baby away for a couple of weeks/months.

As I remember it, it was a Danish, not French, woman. I don’t think they had the baby for that long, the embassy intervened pretty quickly.

Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#213

Post by Nasrudith »

lonelappde wrote: post #154
sixstringtheory wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know where the line is, but I think I would sooner pull my kids out to homeschool than have them be further traumatized/militarized by letting them participate in active shooter drills. It’s insane and will be a self-fulfilling prophecy. The more you expose kids to this kind of lifestyle, the more it becomes... part of their lifestyle.

Yeah, look how utterly ruined we were because we had nuclear bomb drills(!) and earthquake drills.

I know you were being sarcastic but you might be accidentally right. Have you seen the level of fear mongering in politics and a lack of regard for the future from the eras when they existed? I think the nuclear bomb drills may have really ruined them - that or the leaded gasoline.The 'I turned out just fine insistence' is often seen from people who support beating the pattern of abuse in beating their children.

I'm not trying to be a snide jackass here - I suspect it had real deleterious effects but they were normalized and went uncommented upon. The Black Death appeared to have some similar precedent as western culture became utterly desensitized to skeletons and 'the end is nigh' beliefs became a sizeable reoccurring minority to majority. I believe Rome had similar beliefs as some saw the writing on the wall of their decline. I'm not an expert but I wouldn't be surprised it died out in the dark ages as people were in the actual 'post apocalypse' and doing things like former Roman seamen founding Venice.

Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#214

Post by learc83 »

knolax wrote: post #129
mactrey wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kids in Japan lead carefree "be home by dark" lives up until late middle school and high school, when they start studying 4+hrs/day and sleeping <5hrs/night to prep for standardized tests. I don't think Japan is a horrific dystopia for teens but it's hardly the "let kids be kids" culture that America of yesteryear (apparently) was.

> Kids in Japan lead carefree "be home by dark" lives up until late middle school and high school, when they start studying 4+hrs/day and sleeping In my experience the same's true for upper-middle class Americans.

I've never heard of anything outside of a few edge cases doing anything like that here. It's definitely not the norm for upper-middle class kids.

Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#215

Post by learc83 »

austhrow743 wrote: post #188
gitrebase wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are talking about very large cities only. How about most of the U.S. with smaller cities and towns?

The person they replied to said you can't walk around "downtown". In my experience that's a term only used in/for large cities. Smaller cities and towns don't really have CBDs.

Every small town in the south has a "downtown". Often it's the old area of town built up around the railroad tracks.

Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#216

Post by taeric »

mbrumlow wrote: post #3

I have a child. I love him very much. I can not fathom why any parents would not have free time as priority. Free time is amazing. Here is why. - I get a break. - My child gets to learn how to learn on his own. - My child builds independence. - My child learns to manage his time on his own. I see this playing out in the work force too. Far too many people I have worked with that are younger need to be told exactly wh…

With my kids, being boring is the best gift I can give them in a day. They invariably do something awesome. But only after a brief spell of wanting direct guidance. Sometimes not so brief.

Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#217

Post by rayiner »

sgustard wrote: post #210
rayiner wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not hyperbole. It’s happened twice recently in Montgomery County, a DC suburb near me: https://patch.com/maryland/silverspring/mother-free-range-ki... . (It’s one reason we moves two counties over.)

You moved because something happened twice in a county with a population over 1 million? I'm just trying to process the irony of this entire discussion. American kids are over-protected because the media has created a culture of fear that terrible things are constantly happening to kids. Now you're going to flip that hysteria around and apply it to the parents.

While there are a million people in the county, there is just one CPS who brought those charges, run by one set of leadership. And the fact they felt that was an appropriate thing to do is emblematic of how skewed perceptions are in the county about what is normal and abnormal. CPS doesn’t bring charges for conduct that’s completely normal in a community. They did it because it was so unusual it seemed quite reasonable to decision makers that it should be illegal. It wasn’t the risk of being prosecuted by CPS that made us move away, it was the prospect of being surrounded by parents like that.

Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#218

Post by Nasrudith »

knolax wrote: post #146
odessacubbage wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

could you elaborate?

There are a lot of conspiracy theories surrounding Waldorf Schools. Some say that it's a cult.

To be fair it was based upon occultist principles. Saying it was based upon a cult is technically correct. Whether that it is currently relevant is another question - most of the criticisms I have seen is about being antivaxxer.

Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#219

Post by Nasrudith »

rabidrat wrote: post #202
jklp wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have an XKCD bookmarked for this exact thing - with quotes as far back as 1871 about how modern life is just too hectic https://xkcd.com/1227/ Notable quotes such as: > It is, unfortunately, one of the chief characteristics of modern business to be always in a hurry. In olden times it was different. -- The Medical Record, 1884 > If we teach the children how to play and encourage them in their sports ... instead of…

I wonder if there are any quotes like this from before the Industrial Revolution.

I wouldn't be surprised if they were found back in Roman times - in the cities only of course since while farms do require a lot of labor they aren't as time-pressured.

Re: We Have Ruined Childhood

#220

Post by Gibbon1 »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #212
Gibbon1 wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some French lady ten years ago got into a big mess because she parked her stroller out in front of a coffee shop and went inside. Cops and CPS took her baby away for a couple of weeks/months.

As I remember it, it was a Danish, not French, woman. I don’t think they had the baby for that long, the embassy intervened pretty quickly.

You are correct and it's 20 years ago.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/nov/26/anette-soren...

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