A Walk in Hong Kong • Hacker News Board

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#221

Post by mytailorisrich » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 2:31 PM UTC

DanBC wrote: post #204

mytailorisrich wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your link does not mention anything about her being in a public space, and it's difficult to comment on a specific case without knowing all the details. In the UK there is no expectation of privacy in public places and anyone can film or take pictures in public. Case in point: the flourishing tabloid industry of celebrity pictures. The ICO is about data protection. Even websites processing personal data must register…

She was on the street. MGM tried to say, as you are here, that because she was on the street she had no expectation of privacy. English courts disagreed. https://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKHL/2004/22.html > In the UK there is no expectation of privacy in public places and anyone can film or take pictures in public. I've just linked you to a case where that was shown to be untrue. > The ICO is about data protection. Da…

There is no expectation of privacy in public places. You are trying to prove me wrong by subtly shifting the argument.

> You're claiming that because there's no expectation of privacy on the street someone can just run CCTV and do what they like with those images.

I never claimed that. But I will say that there is no legal restriction on filming a public space in England.

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#222

Post by mytailorisrich » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 2:32 PM UTC

ilikehurdles wrote: post #210

mytailorisrich wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The bill was not withdrawn. Same difference, really...

Then why not withdraw it?

To avoid total humiliation?

Even if they withdraw it completely nothing prevent them from introducing another similar bill at a later time anyway, so protesters would not gain anything apart from having humiliated the executive even more.

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#223

Post by SpicyLemonZest » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 2:45 PM UTC

tombh wrote: post #197

mytailorisrich wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But HK is not Taiwan, it didn't naturally come to its anti-CCP ideology through an organic, internal and independent process. Taiwan is anti-CCP because the anti-CCP forces (or rather I should say "government forces") fled there during the Chinese civil war... This is somewhat also the case for Hongkong although I think many in Hongkong migrated there for simple economic reasons.

Yes, so I think you're supporting my point right? Of course HK would be a haven for anti-CCP refugees and in in the last few decades that has come to be an important part of HK's identity. But that doesn't change the facts surrounding the inception of HK as merely a British-held asset to ensure the continued extraction of financial wealth from an Opium-addicted mainland China. Of course I'm not trying to justify the…

That seems like a pretext. It’s hard to understand why China would be motivated oppress the almost entirely Chinese population of Hong Kong because the British were jerks a hundred years ago.

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#224

Post by icsllaf » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 2:45 PM UTC

spectramax wrote: post #61

TASMebWdhWc9NeA wrote: post #51

I am in Verona (Italy) at this time, and I'm in a hotel where some tourists from Shanghai happen to be as well. I'm alone, so I hang out in the lobby a lot. I just engaged in some small talk with some of those tourists, and the discussion somehow shifted to the Hong Kong protests. Basically what they sad is that western culture in Hong Kong clashes with the chinese culture. They don't seem to say that the chinese way…

Let’s replace China with X so there is no xenophobic rebuttals. X is an authoritarian regime that has no rule of law, president has self declared perpetual status in the office, piracy is rampant, no respect for privacy of others, there is an app called ourchat that is effectively owned by the government and is increasing becoming a necessity, no media let alone any kind of investigative journalism especially against…

>If X were an impoverished country like Somalia, the tune would change and most people would condemn such a society

I've actually found that the larger a country is the more criticized it is on human rights violations. If a small country was genociding its own people or anything that X was doing, then the media would simply ignore it as it isn't a large enough story to talk about.

All the examples you give of X are taking place right now across the world in most developing nations yet the focus is placed on the largest ones.

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#225

Post by my_username_is_ » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 2:47 PM UTC

concert-gilled wrote: post #214

idlewords wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The protesters are not calling for independence. They have five specific demands, which boil down to "uphold the law as written", including the right (guaranteed in the Basic Law) to elect their government.

Specific demands which amount to independence rather than integration.

No, there is an important distinction between independence and autonomy. A majority of the protesters support "one country, two system", they just want the two systems to be preserved.

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#226

Post by liberte82 » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 2:49 PM UTC

mytailorisrich wrote: post #154

Quiark wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bill was not withdrawn. It is likely that some of the violence was from undercover cops. But yes, optics matter, that's why they apologised after the airport.

> The bill was not withdrawn. Same difference, really...

Then why not withdraw it?

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#227

Post by tombh » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 2:50 PM UTC

SECProto wrote: post #218

tombh wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm troubled to disagree with your comment, because I usually get so little feedback to such opinions and also it makes it look like I'm CCP stooge. So I should add that I'm British, I just lived in China for a year. Your comment really worries me though, because it seems to me you're conflating the subculture of Guangdong with the culture of Honk Kong, perhaps in an attempt to make a tenuous argument that it is in f…

I think that is a disingenuous take on their comment. They said it is culturally and linguistically distinct from the mainland ruling class. I think it's pretty easy to see how that arose from the historical separation. They specifically mention how it came from years of British rule, and skipping the cultural revolution. They didn't even mention Guangdong.

I think you've misunderstood both them and the geography of South China. They're clearly referring to the Cantonese speaking region, which is called Guangdong (which the British never owned), of which HK is a very small part (perhaps 1/30th of the size). It sounds like you think they were just talking about HK or that the British owned GUangdong. And even more confusingly attributing HK's linguistic distinctiveness to its historical separation by the British?

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#228

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 2:54 PM UTC

davedx wrote: post #45

spyckie2 wrote: post #19

This piece is quite accurate - it really makes you feel like you're in Hong Kong during the protests. References aside, as a US citizen in Hong Kong there are some things that I respect immensely and some things that really get on my nerves about HK. I greatly respect the people and the cause. It reminds me of that one poem - > Do not go gentle into that good night. > Rage, rage against the dying of the light. The pe…

What exactly is Asian culture?

[deleted]

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#229

Post by tombh » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 2:56 PM UTC

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #223

tombh wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, so I think you're supporting my point right? Of course HK would be a haven for anti-CCP refugees and in in the last few decades that has come to be an important part of HK's identity. But that doesn't change the facts surrounding the inception of HK as merely a British-held asset to ensure the continued extraction of financial wealth from an Opium-addicted mainland China. Of course I'm not trying to justify the…

That seems like a pretext. It’s hard to understand why China would be motivated oppress the almost entirely Chinese population of Hong Kong because the British were jerks a hundred years ago.

I sometimes like to have a little thought experiment like this: I'm British, so what if, during the 1800s, China had, through unprovoked war, forced the handing over of the port city of Liverpool because we didn't let them sell us heroin? Or if you're American, think of San Francisco being a sovereign state of the CCP.

Of course you can never justify oppression, but I think such a thought experiment can give some very useful context.

Re: A Walk in Hong Kong

#230

Post by FooBarWidget » Fri, Aug 16, 2019, 3:01 PM UTC

tombh wrote: post #197

mytailorisrich wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But HK is not Taiwan, it didn't naturally come to its anti-CCP ideology through an organic, internal and independent process. Taiwan is anti-CCP because the anti-CCP forces (or rather I should say "government forces") fled there during the Chinese civil war... This is somewhat also the case for Hongkong although I think many in Hongkong migrated there for simple economic reasons.

Yes, so I think you're supporting my point right? Of course HK would be a haven for anti-CCP refugees and in in the last few decades that has come to be an important part of HK's identity. But that doesn't change the facts surrounding the inception of HK as merely a British-held asset to ensure the continued extraction of financial wealth from an Opium-addicted mainland China. Of course I'm not trying to justify the…

I'm from Guangdong. I find it refreshing to see a comment such as yours, that states that you want to look beyond stereotypes and into deeper truths (including historical backgrounds). Like you, I'm also baffled why so few people are uninterested in going beyond stereotypes, and I would also like to know more about the whole thing.

Not sure whether I personally have any insights to give you, but I've found that Quora has many posters that provide information about China's POV, i.e. POVs that are different from what you will typically find on HN. I cannot vouch for how accurate those posts are, but I've found that many of such posts seem to contain quite some detail. Also feel free to contact me for discussions.